SALMONELOSIS Or PARATIFOSIS

[Guest dogeon]

 

why would you want to treat your birds if theres nothing wrong with them

i don't think i explained myself properly i am new to the sport and was advised by someone to treat my birds for selmonella before i pair them up next month as selmonella spreads through the eggs

 

 

[Guest]

i don't think i explained myself properly i am new to the sport and was advised by someone to treat my birds for selmonella before i pair them up next month as selmonella spreads through the eggs

 

 

Salmonella is a very serious infection, but I think it isn't very common in pigeons in the UK. Passing on the bacteria in the egg is more likely a 'carrier state' too I think, the actions of a 'well' bird carrying levels of infective bacteria but itself immune to the disease, rather than a diseased bird, and no amount of antibiotic will change that.

 

My advice would be to steer well clear of self- or blind-treating pigeons with antibiotics. Pigeons are normally very healthy, and won't be long in showing you if something is wrong with them.

 

Salmonella in poultry is a serious issue and EU issued this scientific guidance that it was preferable to kill infected flocks, rather than try to cure or use 'routine preventative antibiotics' on them, main fear is bug resistance.

 

http://www.efsa.europa.eu/EFSA/efsa_locale-1178620753812_1178620777449.htm

 

Opinion of the Scientific Panel on biological hazards (BIOHAZ) related to the use of antimicrobials for the control of Salmonella in poultry Question number: EFSA-Q-2004-079

Adopted date: 21/10/2004

 

Summary

The existing Community legislation on food hygiene and control of zoonoses includes a number of provisions that seek to control and prevent the Salmonella contamination of foodstuffs. Targets for Salmonella spp. will be set progressively in different animal populations: breeding flocks of Gallus gallus, laying hens, broilers, turkeys and slaughter pigs. After each target is set, Member States will have to develop and submit national control programmes to the Commission for its approval.

 

According to the Regulation, it may be decided to establish rules concerning the use of specific control methods in the context of the control programmes. The Regulation lays down that before proposing such rules on specific control methods, the Commission shall consult the European Food Safety Authority. The use of antimicrobials against Salmonella spp. is an example of such potential specific control methods.

 

Salmonella spp is widespread in poultry production in Europe. Prevalences vary considerably depending on country and type of production. Prevalences are lowest at the top of the production pyramid, i.e., the breeder stages. Poultry meat and eggs represent an important source of human infection with Salmonella spp. S. Enteritidis and S. Typhimurium are the most commonly reported serovars isolated from poultry, poultry meat products and human cases of salmonellosis.

 

Antimicrobial resistance in Salmonella spp. and other bacteria is an increasing public health problem. The risk to public health from the selection of resistant organisms depends on the likelihood of this event for a particular bacterium, the behaviour and prevalence of the bacteria, the antimicrobial in question, the type of resistance (transmissible or not, possibility of cross-resistance and co-selection), and type and stage of poultry production. The consequences of resistance to certain antimicrobials, especially fluoroquinolones and cephalosporins, are of particular concern, since these are critically important for therapy of human systemic bacterial infections

 

The basis for successful control of Salmonella infections in poultry farms are good farming and hygienic practices (including all the aspects covering feed, birds, management, cleaning and disinfection, control of rodents etc.) as well as testing and removal of positive flocks from production. In addition, antimicrobial treatment is regarded as an alternative measure to reduce the level of infection. The alternatives to antimicrobial usage in poultry are slaughter and heat treatment, depopulation or other potential treatments.

 

The advantages of antimicrobials used in poultry and listed below must be balanced against the risks associated with the development, selection and spread of antimicrobial resistance.

 

Any use of antimicrobials in poultry will increase the risk of emergence and spread of resistance in zoonotic bacteria such as Salmonella spp. and Campylobacter spp., as well as in animal pathogens and commensal bacteria. However, on the rare occasions when Salmonella causes clinical infections in poultry, antimicrobials may be useful in reducing morbidity and mortality. The use of antimicrobials is never totally effective for the control of Salmonella spp. because it is not possible to eliminate all the organisms from an infected flock However, antimicrobial use may reduce the within-flock prevalence of Salmonella infection and the level of excretion, and reduce environmental contamination. Thereby the likelihood of spread to other flocks may be reduced and may limit the vertical transmission of Salmonella spp.

 

The use of an antimicrobial may select for resistance to other antimicrobials through cross-resistance or co-selection. There is also a danger that antimicrobial treatment may be used as a substitute for good hygiene and biosecurity and so perpetuate the persistence of Salmonella spp. infection in consecutive poultry flocks, which is less likely if infected flocks were slaughtered.

 

Valuable genetic material may be salvaged from infected breeding flocks through the use of antimicrobials to provide Salmonella- free eggs in order to establish a new Salmonella-free flock. In breeder flocks the risk of dissemination of residual Salmonella spp including resistant strains, through the production pyramid is high, compromising any potential advantage of treatment.

 

No specific advantages were identified in the case of laying hens. Some laying flocks may be persistently infected with Salmonella spp. so antimicrobial treatment presents a risk of maintaining a permanent infection cycle in the laying house as well as promoting the development, selection and dissemination of resistance.

 

If infected broiler flocks are not depopulated, antimicrobials may be useful as a short term measure for broiler chicks which have originated from an infected parent flock or contaminated hatchery to limit the extent of subsequent infection. Antimicrobial treatment of meat producing birds increases the risk of carcase contamination with resistant Salmonella spp, Campylobacter spp as well as resistant commensal bacteria, which may also transfer resistance genes to other bacteria.

 

Should antimicrobial resistant bacteria be already present, develop or be acquired, then the use of antimicrobials for the treatment of clinically infected flocks, for the prevention of Salmonella infection, or for the treatment of infected flocks without clinical signs, will enhance the selection and spread of resistant bacterial strains throughout the production pyramid.

 

For the prevention of Salmonella infection and for the treatment of infected breeding flocks in the absence of clinical signs, use of antimicrobials presents a risk of generation and wide dissemination of resistant organisms, through the breeding pyramid. Antimicrobial use in commercial flocks presents a risk of generation of resistant organisms which may contaminate eggs or meat and persist in the house to infect consecutive flocks of birds, whereas not using antimicrobials could lead to the introduction of Salmonella into the food chain.

 

Antimicrobial therapy can reduce the carriage and excretion of Salmonella spp. below the level of detection thereby reducing the diagnostic sensitivity of current monitoring programs, and so may interfere with the detection or confirmation of infection. The misuse of antimicrobials may compromise the effectiveness of live bacterial vaccines, competitive exclusion cultures and probiotics.

 

The Panel concludes that from a food safety/public health viewpoint, using antimicrobials to control Salmonella spp. in poultry has little justification. Any use in exceptional circumstances on animal health and welfare grounds must recognize the consequences for public health.

 

The Scientific Panel on Biological Hazards recommends that the use of antimicrobials for Salmonella control in poultry should be discouraged due to public health risks associated with development, selection and spread of resistance. Their use should be subject to formally defined conditions that would ensure protection of public health. Such use must be fully justified in advance and recorded by the competent authority.

 

For citation purposes: Opinion of the Scientific Panel on Biological Hazards on a request from the Commission related to the use of antimicrobials for the control of Salmonella in poultry. The EFSA Journal (2004) 115, 1-76

 

 

[Taylorsloft]

i use flightpath once a month keeps salmomella at bay £48 for 12 months

[Guest]

i use flightpath once a month keeps salmomella at bay £48 for 12 months

 

I do too, approaching my 1st x 6 months of use.

 

Dogeon - Worth noting that this is a probiotic, or 'competitive exclusion'. Aims to colonise the gut wall with beneficial bacteria which excludes harmful bacteria by (1) sheer numbers, (2)  beneficial bacteria acidifying the gut and (3) beneficial bacteria producing natural antibiotics which see off the harmful harmful bacteria.

 

Can go in drinker or on the food, Merial sell it on-line in 6 months or 12 months batches. Kept in the fridge until day of use.

[sammy]

a bit costly when a £1 youghart out the asda does the same job

[Guest dogeon]

so flight path is like yacult or activa for humans

[Guest]

so flight path is like yacult or activa for humans

 

Yes, same idea. Flight Path is only one of the ones available for pigeons.

 

Sammy is right about live natural yoghurt too, used that for years. Based on lactobacteria which acidify the gut. First went onto it after a talk with my vet following 4 week antibiotic courses for a pigeon I had; knew that I needed a probiotic to follow that antibiotic use, cos antibiotic kills the beneficial bacteria too, he offered 4 brand names but was quite happy to let me go the natural way, yoghurt, cos that is what I wanted at that time.

 

1kg pot of yoghurt will set you back around a £1. Good thing about it is it sticks to the grain all by itself - you need oil for Flight Path, and yoghurt is the cheapest option if you have only a few pigeons, Flight Path sachet is designed for 50 pigeons. Gob a tablespoonful or two of yoghurt on top of a bowl of feeding for the birds for just that one day, mix it in, then spoon it into feeder. They'll maybe take their time over it till they get the taste proper.

 

Give it on 3 consecutive days each month, found that any more and their droppings will go loose. Also remember to wash the feeder after each sitting cos it  stinks as it dries out, and 'milk' left lying is a good medium for growing anything, including the very stuff you're trying to avoid.

[Guest dogeon]

 

Yes, same idea. Flight Path is only one of the ones available for pigeons.

 

Sammy is right about live natural yoghurt too, used that for years. Based on lactobacteria which acidify the gut. First went onto it after a talk with my vet following 4 week antibiotic courses for a pigeon I had; knew that I needed a probiotic to follow that antibiotic use, cos antibiotic kills the beneficial bacteria too, he offered 4 brand names but was quite happy to let me go the natural way, yoghurt, cos that is what I wanted at that time.

 

1kg pot of yoghurt will set you back around a £1. Good thing about it is it sticks to the grain all by itself - you need oil for Flight Path, and yoghurt is the cheapest option if you have only a few pigeons, Flight Path sachet is designed for 50 pigeons. Gob a tablespoonful or two of yoghurt on top of a bowl of feeding for the birds for just that one day, mix it in, then spoon it into feeder. They'll maybe take their time over it till they get the taste proper.

 

Give it on 3 consecutive days each month, found that any more and their droppings will go loose. Also remember to wash the feeder after each sitting cos it  stinks as it dries out, and 'milk' left lying is a good medium for growing anything, including the very stuff you're trying to avoid.

thanks that sounds an easier way as i have only got a few pigeons, and like you said the sachets are for about 50 pigeons so i would have to divide the sachet and guess the amount

 

 

[Tony C]

i was told tonight to treat my birds for selmonella before i pair them up, can any one enlighten me as to why? and what to get?

 

Your playing with fire if you go down this road dogeon, I’ll tell you why I think this. The drugs you use to treat against this will also kill the good bacteria as already stated by others. There are some virus's/bacteria that your pigeons may be hosting that the drug wont touch, by treating you will effectively be giving the chance to let these virus's/bacteria multiply uncontested. Be careful with anti-biotics, you could be doing more harm than good!

[Guest dogeon]

 

Your playing with fire if you go down this road dogeon, I’ll tell you why I think this. The drugs you use to treat against this will also kill the good bacteria as already stated by others. There are some virus's/bacteria that your pigeons may be hosting that the drug wont touch, by treating you will effectively be giving the chance to let these virus's/bacteria multiply uncontested. Be careful with anti-biotics, you could be doing more harm than good!

thanks i dont plan on giving them antibiotics i will stick to the yoguht

 

 

[DOVEScot]

a bit costly when a £1 youghart out the asda does the same job

 

Do you let the youghart dry after mixing or feed while still wet?

[Guest]

 

Do you let the youghart dry after mixing or feed while still wet?

 

I've always fed it as soon as its mixed, and there is only enough mixed for one feed. As soon as the birds have finished [15 minutes later] I take the feeder out, and clean & disinfect it.

[Bully]

As a new member to the sport, it has been suggested that I inject all old birds against paratyphoid before breeding commences. Is this information correct or not?

[homer]

neva heard of it ..........................................................................

dnt do it  ???????????

[Guest]

As a new member to the sport, it has been suggested that I inject all old birds against paratyphoid before breeding commences. Is this information correct or not?

 

all u need to really do is the usual things, canker ,cocci. after treatment give them some multi vitamins.,paratyphoid can be treated in a powder form which u put in their water...which is much easier then injecting.

[Hogni]

Here is a website i´ve found very helpful if i suspect there is something wrong with my birds

 

http://www.chevita.com/en/pigeons/symptoms/index.php

 

And by the way i think you should not medicate your birds unless there is something wrong cause if you medicate healthy birds you are weakening thier immune system

[DOVEScot]

As a new member to the sport, it has been suggested that I inject all old birds against paratyphoid before breeding commences. Is this information correct or not?

 

You do inject for paramyxo before the race season

http://www.pigeonbasics.com/forum/blah/m-1195378696/s-0/highlight-paramyxo/#num0

[paul k]

I never inject for paratyphoid, but i do treat for it in powder form once a year for 10 days as instructed by a top dutch vet, ive been treating for it for 8 years now.

[Guest]

I never inject for paratyphoid, but i do treat for it in powder form once a year for 10 days as instructed by a top dutch vet, ive been treating for it for 8 years now.

and what product do you use Paul ? why did you start using it ?  and what are the benefits ?   thanks in advance  ;D ;D          andy

 

 

[Guest rodders]

paratyphoid is a bigger problem than most people realise as pigeons can carry it for years and show no signs of it

i think that now in belgium they have to vaccinate against it by law shows how big the problem is getting

[Guest]

paratyphoid is a bigger problem than most people realise as pigeons can carry it for years and show no signs of it

i think that now in belgium they have to vaccinate against it by law shows how big the problem is getting

 

I've asked elsewhere how prevalent this is in pigeons in the UK, and still wait an answer.

 

I also suspect the Belgians are reaping what they've maybe sown themselves. Treat for an illness that doesn't exist in the bird, or treat less than recommended dose or duration, and you create bugs resistant to the medication you use, and all others in the same class. The Sunday name for it is 'select for' [the organism you are trying to eradicate] Already evidence for it in canker and cocci in pigeons.

[thomasxx1]

ih  there im treating my birds for paratyphoid with furazo  lidon+ just wondering does  anyone know if its any good

[paul k]

I use Parastop from De Weerd. i started using it after being asked ' have you treated for paratyphoid this year' to which i replied 'treated for what'?? by a top fancier in the area. 90x1st in the last 4 years, i'm not changing my routine.

 

Paratyphoid is spread by mice and rats urine carried into the loft on shoes, or when the birds peck around the garden. it does not matter how careful you are, but a simple treatment will prevent this from spreading.

 

 

[Guest]

I use Parastop from De Weerd. i started using it after being asked ' have you treated for paratyphoid this year' to which i replied 'treated for what'?? by a top fancier in the area. 90x1st in the last 4 years, i'm not changing my routine.

 

Paratyphoid is spread by mice and rats urine carried into the loft on shoes, or when the birds peck around the garden. it does not matter how careful you are, but a simple treatment will prevent this from spreading.

 

;D thanks for the reply Paul ,what were youre results like before using it?     thanks again                                         andy

 

 

[Guest CS]

Parastop- How much? Paul