Old Pied

Hi Old Yellow If I understand you correct, your hens and cocks will train together, but the hens will have a 'head-start' as they will be training 30min by the time the cocks join them. What will be the reason for this, is it your view that hens need more training than cocks? Regards Old Pied

Hi All Trying my hand at widowhood for 1st time this year, mailed about it few weeks ago. I have 18 widowhood boxes with 18 cocks, all two year old. I introduced 30 hens so that they could pick and choose, two hens lay in 10 days time, but most hens only 4 days after the 1st two hens. I plan to put cocks on 'dry widowhood', and if I understand it right, it means they do not raise a baby, but eggs are removed, with the hen, after 10 days. But what about hens than lay 4 days later than 1st hens, must I leave then also for 10 days with eggs, or must I remove their eggs and hens together with the two hens that lay 4 days before then? Regards Old Pied

Remove grit while giving antibiotics (all kinds just to be on safe side). Other medication, leave grit in. Regards Old Pied

Hi All Nice to have a few minutes to chat again, been bussy at work, real 'mad house'. Like 2 hear your view on following. Fellow fancier breeds me a round (1st round) of babies each year, and in my loft the hens are by far the better racers, but in his loft, with the 2nd round, the cocks (of the same matings) are the better racers. Would you suggest it is due to different management, and if so, what could cause the difference. In the passed nor me or my friend raced on widowhood, both of us just natural. Regards Old Pied

Hi All Well then it seems that majority fanciers (who replied) think that good management are 'more important' than good birds. Well I'll also go for B. Since it is all about 'who will win the avareges at the end of the year?', I think that B with good management will fly more consistant over a period of months, maybe not even winning a single race, but should be there 'near the front' more often than not. 'A' would get his wins (every now and then), but missing the sheet every few races due to bad managment, would not make 'A' a champion. My 50 cents worth Regards Old Pied

Hi All Like 2 hear your view on following... Lets say fancier A and fancier B are neighbours. They race in the same organization. They both compete in all the races in the year, they birds are healthy. BUT..., Fancier A has gr8 birds, better than fancier B's average birds. But fancier B has gr8 management, better than fancier A's management. Who would you put your money on to win the averages at the end of the season? Regards Old Pied

Hi Black w f Agree, we forget no.2 so easy during 'combat'

Hi owen Can we perhaps combine your 'rule' (find a system that suits the person) with Andys rule that novice should obtain birds from one person. Perhaps we can say that a novice must look for fancier whose system will suit him/her (time and money), and if this person is racing well, one should 'earmark' such a person to obtain round of youngsters from? Just a suggestion

Hi Andy I agree about good birds, FROM ONE PERSON, as then the novice can also obtain the training program on which those birds perform from the same flyer, and saves alot of time and money by not having to figure it out himself. Hi Soapy I suggested only two as it must be the most important, and that way we can compile 'golden rules' and not just 'rules. You can mention more, was just a suggestion to mention only 2. What is acat box (i am in South Africa, dont know the term/product?) Regards, Old Pied

Hi All Lets say a novice approach you asking for advice. What is the 2 moste important things you would tell him to look out for / do when starting as novice/newby. Let limit (if you want) the advice to two items per member, and try not to repeat what was already said. Lets then see if we can 'agree to disagree' on the maybe 10 most important things to look out for/do, and perhaps we would be 'indirectly' reminding ourself of things we know, but forgot. My advice would be: 1-Never over-populate your loft 2-Write down day-by-day what you do with birds, and also what you give them, thus keep record.

Hi Wilkins first and most important, there is no 'rule fixed in stone' as to what is the best way to feed your birds, but guidelines do exist. What you put in, you must get out, otherwise you would end up with birds to heavy and not wanting to train/fly anymore. What you feed also depends on how hard you toss your birds (training around the loft in general does not take out of the birds as much as road training, as with road training there can be no 'flapping around', it is just full steam ahead), how cold it is (birds use more energy to keep warm) etc. As distance increase, I would feed versele-laga Energy plus as from Monday till Wednesday, (Basket Thursday and race Saturday) but as a 'snack' lunch time (13h00) and not as a full meal. Be carefull of overfeeding, i think many fanciers are guilty of that. I like to feed 3 times per day, as i believe it gives the birds body more opportunity to digest what they need from the seeds. Google the word 'Gordon Chalmers' and choose 'Dietary Considerations in Pigeon Racing'. Would like to hear others view on this info given by G. Chalmers, how you understand it, and how you would apply this knowledge in practise. Regards

I would agree that GerriPlus is good carb mix, and has many small seeds which i prefer as I think small seeds put less 'stress' on the birds to digest the seeds. As high fat i use EnergyPlus. But surely there are many on the market. Important aspect as mentioned by 'cloudview' is to feed high fats only to birds you are intending to race that weekend, otherwise you could end up with birds that are to heavy due to not 'taking out what you put in'. Regards

Hi Wilkens, Strapper and All That is a very important and good question Wilkens. If it takes 48 hours + for a pigeon to digest and store fat containing seeds in energy form, then it is of 'no' use to only feed fats at end of week just before basket, since the energy (fat) supplied by those seeds will only be available by the time the bird arrives home, or even later. One of the Ace flyers in SA once told me that he feeds high fat containing seeds on Monday and Tuesday (basket Thursday, race Saturday) as that way he can be sure the fat containing seeds are in the birds 'system' by the time it is liberated. Looking at the article that Gorden Charmers once wrote about feeding of racing pigeons, one should also keep the carbs high in feed when feeding fat containing seeds as the carbs assist the body to digest and store fat. Just my 50cents worth. Regards Old Pied

Thanx Kev Just this morning I ordered the dvd 'Wonderful Widowhood' by John Halstead. Have you watched it before.? Hope it will assist me in my 'new adventure' on 'widowhood'. Do you perhaps know if the video you mentioned is still available, and where? Regards Old Pied

Last 9 years different person to win Federation each year.

Hi 'wilkins' Can you perhaps elaburate on what you mean with 'the feeding method in the book may be a little out of date'. Widowood still new 2 me, and I am made to believe that the feeding method of these cocks are very important (as with all racing birds) in order to be successful . So please assist, would like to hear your few. Regards Old Pied

Hi Skull I would let the ranging continue for at least 4 weeks before 1st toss, as they might get into trouble on 1st toss, and then they will need the stumina and knowledge of the area, to be able to get back to the loft. My 1st toss is alway 30km, but it must be perfect weather (no clouds/strong wind etc), and the team must be ranging for at least a period of 4 weeks when training around the loft. One of our top flyers in the federation where i am racing, only train his birds around the loft for one week, then he starts with a 5 km toss. So there are many ways, but rather be safe than sorry, I suggest training them around the loft for at least 4 weeks before 1st toss. Just my 50 cents worth Regards Old Pied

Hi all Thanx so much for info. Got hold of the book. Will keep you up to date, first of all I must get them threw a propper moult. Regards Old Pied

Thanx All. Will have to get hold of this book as soon as possible. I checked Amazon, but cant seem to find it. Any other suggestions where i can get hold of this book. I really want to make this work.

Since my widowood loft has two windows in the front, I will make a plan to be able to cover them when other birds are training. I have read that one should only allow the widowood cocks to feed young till 14 days, and then remove young with female before she lays again. Would you agree with that?

Thanx for all the info. The moult ends early March, and racing starts 1st week of June, so birds should be finish with moult. It seems like i'll have to pair them beginning March and let the rear one round, after which the training will start. Why is it that widowood cocks do not need as much training once they started racing? Like you mentioned earlier OldYellow, widowood Cocks are 'easier and dont need training after first race'. Why is this?? Our natural birds get 3 tosses per week of 70km each, and then a furhter 200 km toss over weekends, and that is how most of the fanciers toss. Regards Old Pied

Hi All Here in South Africa many fanciers claim that the reason widowood cant work here, is because we are racing in the winter, which is not the breeding season and as such the hormones of the pigeons are not as 'active' as in early summer when the breeding season starts, and as such the cocks are not so 'homed-in' on the hens in order for the system to be successfull. Dont know if you would agree with that. Regards Old Pied

Thanx OldYellow, will try to get hold of it. Regards Old Pied

Hi OldYellow I am going to 'try my hand' at widowood this year. In 2009 I raced +-70 yearling pigeons, and kept the 'best' (based on performance) 18 cocks. I only raced these cocks in 5 races from 230km up to 660km. These 18 all flew very well over these 5 races. I have build a new seperate loft in which i have installed 18 widowood boxes (nice big boxes 600mmx600mmx600mm). I have settled these 18 cocks in the new loft, and they also know the new trap. What is the next step you suggest. Our moulting season starts end of January till early march, and racing season starts beginning June. Regards Old Pied

Hi All New member to list. From South Africa. Been following post last few days, very interesting. Like to knw if any of you can think of reason as to why widowood could not and does not work in South Africa, as many fanciers here have tried it, but failed. Would like to try it myself, so any suggestions would help. Regards Old Pied