Keepsmilingqueen Posted January 17, 2007 Report Posted January 17, 2007 hi, im considering switching my birds to open hole, as university is restricting the time i have available to routinely exersize them, are there any fanciers that use open hole and can it be used for both young + old birds ??? does it really help them to become more streetwise or will they just sit on the houses all day and attract complaints from my neighbours ? also i dont currently have a hawk problem but they have been known the frequent the area in years past, i dont want to become a hawk magnet either. The old birds are flown on the natural system, and the young birds are flown to the perch. it wasnt my intention to hopper feed them, i was still planning to feed am + pm thanx in advance sharron ps i also wasnt intending for this to replace training tosses, its just an extra thought to try and increase fitness levels.
mac1 Posted January 17, 2007 Report Posted January 17, 2007 i used open hole last season because i was on the wrong shift at work,i would go in the morning give them ther brekfast and leave the let open.then after work take them for a short training chuck not everyday may b mon,wed,thur..it worked well for me,but of course ther is always dangers of leaving your let open hawks,cats ect
Peckedhen Posted January 17, 2007 Report Posted January 17, 2007 I've had open loft all winter with no problems (I've only 19 birds though). I think it's paid off.....the birds have all laid within 12 days of pairing - no fat hens!! My neighbours don't mind - they love to see my white 'doves' flying; they might think differently if they knew they are pigeons!! ;D ;D
blackjack Posted January 17, 2007 Report Posted January 17, 2007 I fly open hole its a good method if it suits you they get sharp to the hawks so give it a go.
Guest Posted January 17, 2007 Report Posted January 17, 2007 Its got its good points and bad yes i think they get street wise and plenty of exersize but wait till you start racing and they sit on the roof for ten min you wont have any hair left and once they start it i dont think you will change them have lost many a race with that i changed 2 years ago and would never change back you have to be able to control the birds or they will control you and i dont think birds suffer to much by bieng kept in as long as you train them before a race i know that work can sometime dictate the time u have with the birds but try and make other arangments if its long distance it doesnt mater as much just use the early racing to train them and you might have some time later to give them some tosses before they go to the big one DONT DO IT
jimmy white Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 in my opinion open hole pigeons are better and easier to get fit for really difficult long races,, 600 miles plus, and they do get more street wise
Guest Hjaltland Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 My birds are on open hole soon after pairing up... weather permitting, There is very little sitting on roofs, i suspect because they are taken up with nesting, laying sitting rearing etc. When they are out they are either flying or rooting around in the land around us. I also train as much as time permits and keep a good eye on body weight/condition as they do get quite a bit of feed naturally. The birds have to race over very arduous terrain and sea so the open hole keeps them fit for that purpose. I'm lucky in the fact that cats dont bother me much.. its still a thought though as our neighbour, 100 yds away, has about six cats, she's a member of the cats protection league... we still manage to exist together!! :
stevebelbin Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Its got its good points and bad yes i think they get street wise and plenty of exersize but wait till you start racing and they sit on the roof for ten min you wont have any hair left and once they start it i dont think you will change them have lost many a race with that i changed 2 years ago and would never change back you have to be able to control the birds or they will control you and i dont think birds suffer to much by bieng kept in as long as you train them before a race i know that work can sometime dictate the time u have with the birds but try and make other arangments if its long distance it doesnt mater as much just use the early racing to train them and you might have some time later to give them some tosses before they go to the big one DONT DO IT Interesting point!! I am going to use open hole for my Ybs to get them street wise and save time for me. I was thinking of using open hole up until 2 weeks b4 racing and then splitting the sexes and racing them back to eachother. This should hopefully make them kean to trap . One question: - When putting YBs on open hole do you settle them first then leave them on open hole. Or just leave the trap open from day one??
Guest slugmonkey Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 I have 3 lofts that havent been closed more than 3 weeks total in 2 years, I think open hole is the best thing you can do for your birds you do have to work with them right before the races start (YB's) I havent had any trapping problems with the older ones and once you get out to 200 miles or 4 hours on wing they usally trap with NO problem I have 65 late hatches that are flying out all the time I dont even have a door on the loft now as I am building a new landing board they are staying out for 1-2 hours and I have spotted them at 5+ miles away from home it was 14 degrees here with sleet ( Kansas ) and they were out flying in it if you are bringing them in with feed 2 times a day I wouldnt think your trapping problems woul be very bad I hopper feed and don't really have any problems
stevebelbin Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 I have 3 lofts that havent been closed more than 3 weeks total in 2 years, I think open hole is the best thing you can do for your birds you do have to work with them right before the races start (YB's) I havent had any trapping problems with the older ones and once you get out to 200 miles or 4 hours on wing they usally trap with NO problem I have 65 late hatches that are flying out all the time I dont even have a door on the loft now as I am building a new landing board they are staying out for 1-2 hours and I have spotted them at 5+ miles away from home it was 14 degrees here with sleet ( Kansas ) and they were out flying in it if you are bringing them in with feed 2 times a day I wouldnt think your trapping problems woul be very bad I hopper feed and don't really have any problems Do you tend not to lose many YBs racing this way?? Or do you suffer the same losses as we all seem to??
Guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Interesting point!! I am going to use open hole for my Ybs to get them street wise and save time for me. I was thinking of using open hole up until 2 weeks b4 racing and then splitting the sexes and racing them back to eachother. This should hopefully make them kean to trap . One question: - When putting YBs on open hole do you settle them first then leave them on open hole. Or just leave the trap open from day one?? Steve I have had my youngsters on open hole for past 3 years with great success, very few losses as I am sure they see plenty of the countryside through the summer as they disappear enough. Like you I then split them just before racing and that is enough to spur the racing edge on. I don't however put them on open hole straight away until they are bunching together and strong on the wing. Then I know if the hawk comes for a daily visit they can get out of the way and up in teh sky. Any earlier and you will lose them around the garden daily.
Guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Just as an example of my losses steve last 3 years are as follows. 2004 bred 75 finished with 67 (raced full programme inc classics) 2005 bred 72 finished with 61 (raced full programme inc classics) 2006 bred 50 finished with 48 (bred later so moult rubbish decided not to race youngsters) single tossed them all right through season, not one toss in a batch up to 50 miles.
stevebelbin Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Cheers Darren Thats exactly what I was thinking, get them bunching and then just leave them to do what kids do best - roam and gain there own life experience, surely it must have a massive benefit on the birds over having them stuck in the loft all day long . Steve
Guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Wait till you feel how they muscle up just before racing, they literally feel like metal after flying out all summer. Fit as any widowhood cock. Training is a doddle when they are like this. I normally start them at 10 miles for about 3 tosses then 3 tosses at 15 then out to 30 miles any direction for as many as I think they need before racing. Then when racing starts get them on a line of flight training point. You can guarantee flying out all summer they already know most of this terrain anyway. I had youngsters year before on a really windy day went ranging came back after 6 hours absolutely pooped myself. Thought thats it lost em all. Then a couple came, and another and another, basically had them all in an hour in ones and twos. Now either they got caught in the wind and the mileage they did in two hours one direction took 4 hours to come back in to the wind. Or they basically got tangled with someone training up country or something, whatever happened it didn't stop them getting home. Yet I have club memebers tell me a batch of birds went over their lofts and took their youngsters never to be seen again. Two weeks later sent to first race and where I am on line of flight in club is furthest southerly and easterly so nowhere near drag. Actually dog leg by quite some distance. Never see birds come over but this day saw a batch of 16 coming one direction and another batch of 11 from a slightly more southerly direction. I crossed my fingers and hoped one of them was for me as seeing birds was agood sign. As they got nearer they looked to be all slowing but just thought the youngens were confused cause one or two were dropping out, they were all mine it turned out. Had sent 35 and got 27 coming together. Bedlam anyway clocked 4 and took first 4 in club but only got about 3rd fed as the line of flight was no where near me. The youngsters were just blooming well educated and I am sure it is down to the open hole because I never used to get youngsters drop like I do now.
stevebelbin Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 How do you feed them on your system, do you hopper feed them and feed tit-bits to get them to come etc. Cant wait to get them on open hole now
Guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 I feed them a small quantity of feed in the morning, 50/50 depurative and hormorform. Then in the afternoon when I get them in as much as they can eat of a high protein mix with beans peas and maize. Then once racing starts I change to a lighter widowhood mix to race on. I get them hooked on peanuts at an early age which I feed from a bright blue a bright blue bucket, so if for any reason I want them in early I just shake the bucket inside the loft and they trap like darts.
Guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Agree that open hole is a good system, provided that you educate the birds to stay away from house roofs and that your set-up is proof against cats etc. One major plus (for me) is for the natural flier away all day either at work, college, uni etc. Even on a twice-a-day exercise system, you are unlikely to be able to get the sitting hens out.. mornings cocks out OK, evenings (after 6pm) the hens are back on eggs after being locked up all day ... and so evening exercise ... its cocks again. I'd that problem last year.
stevebelbin Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Cheers Darren and Bruno, ive just printed this topic out ;D. Great idea with the blue bucket and peanuts ;D. How have you cat proofed your loft Bruno. Im making an opening in my loft as high as possible and taking my sputnik off in the hope a cat wont be able to get that high. And im fitting a trellis to stop any attack over the roof and fitting a cat-deterent to the fence pointing at the trap to the loft. I do have a cat that comes in now again and did attack last years YBs, but that was because Id left the loft door wide open!!
stevebelbin Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 As for training I work 15miles away and can take them every day - Old birds that is ;D
Guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Word of warning I have been mobbed walking up the garden with the blue bucket, pigeons landing all over me - looks like something from the hitchcock movie 'THE BIRDS!!!'. ;D ;D ;D ;D
Guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Well like most other folks I had done everything legally & physically possible to deter cats ... then discovered one round my back garden. So now hi-tec since late last year, animalchaser (B&R) on 24/7, no signs since. Same for rodents. Have noted other PB members following the hi-tec road latest being with hawk deterrents too, playing CDs eagle owl calls . Take your point Steve about training and taking the birds with you ... I tried this with my hens early morning taking them 20 miles West to Glasgow let go on Clydeside near Kingston Bridge around 0730 twice a week. Meant I was lifting them straight off the nest and they detested it, so I stopped. Open hole, I've seen the hens get 'relieved' by the cocks from 1100 onwards, and go out in small groups of 3/4 'touring'. Basically backwards and forwards all day including 'building' bringing in twigs from the garden. Think exercise is important for the natural hen, when she's sitting she's in the box 18 hours per day.
stevebelbin Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Word of warning I have been mobbed walking up the garden with the blue bucket, pigeons landing all over me - looks like something from the hitchcock movie 'THE BIRDS!!!'. ;D ;D ;D ;D LOL I bet you look like the bird-women in HomeAlone ;D ;D
stevebelbin Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 Well like most other folks I had done everything legally & physically possible to deter cats ... then discovered one round my back garden. So now hi-tec since late last year, animalchaser (B&R) on 24/7, no signs since. Same for rodents. Have noted other PB members following the hi-tec road latest being with hawk deterrents too, playing CDs eagle owl calls . Take your point Steve about training and taking the birds with you ... I tried this with my hens early morning taking them 20 miles West to Glasgow let go on Clydeside near Kingston Bridge around 0730 twice a week. Meant I was lifting them straight off the nest and they detested it, so I stopped. Open hole, I've seen the hens get 'relieved' by the cocks from 1100 onwards, and go out in small groups of 3/4 'touring'. Basically backwards and forwards all day including 'building' bringing in twigs from the garden. Think exercise is important for the natural hen, when she's sitting she's in the box 18 hours per day. I know the owner of the cat so I cant do anything illegal with it anyhow LOL!! Cant really complain to him either as Ive two of my own (house cats - dont ask LOL)!! So ill have to purchase the same as you from B & R ;D ;D. Know what id rather do with it but such is life ;D ;D
Guest Posted January 18, 2007 Report Posted January 18, 2007 LOL I bet you look like the bird-women in HomeAlone ;D ;D pretty much lol. 8)
Guest slugmonkey Posted January 26, 2007 Report Posted January 26, 2007 I caught neighbors cat in loft ( hadnt killed anything was in live trap ) so I notified her that I had the cat we then took the garden hose in loft and sprayed cat excessively ( cats hate water ) a month later I caught same cat again ( saw it go in ) so we put her in live trap and sprayed again its been 6 months and the cat dosent go near the loft anymore
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now