nest mates paired together

[Guest TIMBARRA LOFTS]

spencer have you tried your birds in the british one loft races, if so how've they done. thanks.

 

The answer to that is no I have not mate, maybe one day but not yet. we can only see..

 

 

regards spencer

 

 

[thunderboult]

these are the parents to the nestmates the pencil wf(infront)is sire  and the blue to the right is the dam the cock is a g-son of donkere prins(meulemans) and the hen full sister to kulpa bros hen that was 2 nd open nfc(de klak/van loon)

  

[Guest TIMBARRA LOFTS]

these are the parents to the nestmates the pencil wf(infront)is sire  and the blue to the right is the dam the cock is a g-son of donkere prins(meulemans) and the hen full sister to kulpa bros hen that was 2 nd open nfc(de klak/van loon)

  

 

 

Fabulous pigeons, I am impressed by their quality and your stockmanship in selecting quality. what other meulemans do you have...  

 

[thunderboult]

only him.

[Guest TIMBARRA LOFTS]

I do not know your full name but you have an eye for quality and lineage.

 

i think by the quality in that pic, winning for you is made easy... gems all of them .

[Guest]

 

Mr Bowler, if the birds have been responsible for generations of winners then I think you would be a happier man than many with your eye for mating 2 individuals and generating the results you had in doing so.

 

In ref to the hen having no pedigree .. I would love to have known her lineage and the cock also, every fancier is different and some do well and some dont, as long as your happy with the bird or birds obtained that is what matters i think.

 

I do have in my stock loft a cock that has sired 8 different Federation winners with different hens, i think many top fanciers would be more than happy with this bird, he has winners in his pedigree for every generation going back to the super couple of Karel Meulemans, so I am a very happy man yes , and thank you for your kind words.

 

I do also have a cock that i have kept on my loft for 5 years without breeding from him, he has no racing record, i kept him and retained him as he is a son of my number 1 hen and she is responsible for 4 generations of winning birds for me and others. This cock was bred from for the first time in 2007 and the 2 youngsters from him both won !!  I have not bred from him since as i do not breed loads of birds sir, the cocks sire which was a 94 pigeon won 1 card in competition and the sire of the 94 pigeon bred 34 1st prize winners !!  i owned this cock also. So i do believe lineage is a thing we can rely on , but just sometines exceptions do crop up, but in these exceptions the pigeons have winners in their ancestry, would you not agree ?  

 

kindest regards spencer

 

 

Spencer i never give myself credit for breeding anything, racing maybe not breeding, nature decides and takes credit for that one, i'm just sometimes lucky enough to have paired them together. In the case of that pair they actually paired themselves, and first round was on the floor in the stock loft.

 

I thinkits fair to say 99% of pigeons would have winners in their ancestry somewhere, so in that way its a win win situation isn't it?

 

Who was the cock that bred 34 x1sts? thats some record i'm sure he must be a well known bird?

 

What are the desired Traits you like to see?

 

[Guest TIMBARRA LOFTS]

 

Spencer i never give myself credit for breeding anything, racing maybe not breeding, nature decides and takes credit for that one, i'm just sometimes lucky enough to have paired them together. In the case of that pair they actually paired themselves, and first round was on the floor in the stock loft.

 

I thinkits fair to say 99% of pigeons would have winners in their ancestry somewhere, so in that way its a win win situation isn't it?

 

Who was the cock that bred 34 x1sts? thats some record i'm sure he must be a well known bird?

 

What are the desired Traits you like to see?

 

Mr Bowler I can only say the bird in your question and post was a super producer 86L96707 if my memory serves me well, unfortunatly I gave this super producer to a friend , you ask how well known was the pigeon?  by some maybe and by some maybe not, the pigeon was a fantstic producer and was bought by me from a gentleman who won 70 x 1st in 4 years !!!  one son won 15 x 1st including 5x1st open !!  the gentleman raced only 9 widow cocks total.

 

My desired traits that I look for in the VDB pigeon which I have a very detailed knowledge of are clearly stated on my website for all to see, I have not hidden the fact of what this family should consist of and be.

 

I would like it if you did have a look and not request me to sit and typr it all here as it takes some time, as you can appreciate sir.

 

thanks for your comments , they are most welcome.

 

 

 

[OLDYELLOW]

How many top pro soccer stars or any other sports stars do you know where there parents were as good? Not many, so why have they become so good with no previous "superior" genes?

 

 

just because the parents had no intrest in soccer doesnt mean they were bad footballers , it's just they dint wish to utilise or gain skills in that area   but a valid point just because two champion pigeons are paired together they can easily breed as many doughnuts as there like  

[little sam]

 

just because the parents had no intrest in soccer doesnt mean they were bad footballers , it's just they dint wish to utilise or gain skills in that area   but a valid point just because two champion pigeons are paired together they can easily breed as many doughnuts as there like  

 

Best answer ive heard on this this thread so far ;D

[OLDYELLOW]

 

No mate i meant these birds were responsible for generations of winners, not bred from. The cock was bred by someone who had not won a race in all the time i knew him. The hen was bought at a charity sale, no pedigree, but why only a fiver, The owner was a joke! I bought it cos it was a grizzle! They had no traits, no proven form, just luck i suppose!

 

 

just as the bird dint have a marvelous pedigree doesnt make it a bad pigeon , just because the flyer hadnt won a race also doesnt make his birds bad im sure most buy from winners in order to breed winners im sure if shown the way he could easily win , no doubt he has good birds but not the management or system that suits them   but then again he may get his pleasure from been with them and homing rather than racing

[Guest TIMBARRA LOFTS]

 

Best answer ive heard on this this thread so far ;D

 

 

 

thats your valued opinion sam and opinions vary, hope you have a good season my friend

 

[little sam]

 

 

 

thats your valued opinion sam and opinions vary, hope you have a good season my friend

 

And you

[Guest]

 

just because the parents had no intrest in soccer doesnt mean they were bad footballers , it's just they dint wish to utilise or gain skills in that area   but a valid point just because two champion pigeons are paired together they can easily breed as many doughnuts as there like  

 

I grew up with two pro football players both played for England and i can tell you that their parents (well dads) could'nt kick a ball straight let alone anything else!!

 

 

[OLDYELLOW]

 

I grew up with two pro football players both played for England and i can tell you that their parents (well dads) could'nt kick a ball straight let alone anything else!!

 

 

the good footballers utilised and learned there skills give a football to several animals in a zoo some will play with it say a seal / dolphin and can be trained to shoot hoops , but they werent born with these skill but taught them a lion would punture and rip his ball but that already set in his nature   , i see a pigeons gene pool like this imagine each bird like a bowl of soup they all have different tastes some bitter some sweet some tart some zesty some salty , right all these different blends of soup ( genes ) can produce winners but its getting the ballance right in your blends or you get more breeder if family too inbred then you need a cross but finding pigeons that compliment the existing birds  

[Guest]

Timbarra, just looked at your website, still can't see what "traits " you look for other than bloodlines.

 

Also could'nt see a mention of the cock that bred 34 x 1sts, or the cock 8 x1st fed???

 

How many Ybs have you sold since 2007?

[Guest]

 

the good footballers utilised and learned there skills give a football to several animals in a zoo some will play with it say a seal / dolphin and can be trained to shoot hoops , but they werent born with these skill but taught them a lion would punture and rip his ball but that already set in his nature   , i see a pigeons gene pool like this imagine each bird like a bowl of soup they all have different tastes some bitter some sweet some tart some zesty some salty , right all these different blends of soup ( genes ) can produce winners but its getting the ballance right in your blends or you get more breeder if family too inbred then you need a cross but finding pigeons that compliment the existing birds  

 

Sorry mate you are totally wrong about footballers!! Like i say i've played with some very good lads, a couple in the same team as me, but its a natural talent, i agree they still have a lot to learn, if it was that easy they would'nt be getting paid the mega bucks they do as there would be a ronaldo on every street corner.

 

Nice comparison with the soup, genes when crossed can do all sorts, produce extroardinary exceptions, sometimes even in humans mass murderers!! But if you add a tomato soup to a tomato soup does it taste more tomatoey?

 

[retired]

I still cant personally see what is wrong with pairing nestmates together, i wonder if someone who has never done it could tell me why they havent?

[Guest]

I still cant personally see what is wrong with pairing nestmates together, i wonder if someone who has never done it could tell me why they havent?

 

Chris maybe i never had superior pigeons, but i have done it and not done any good for racing but have used it as a first cross breeding wise,  into another family with good results.

 

 

[Guest TIMBARRA LOFTS]

Hi Mick,

The Donkere witpen 1313 is the cock that has bred 8 federation winners, he is i think pair 6 or 8, and the cock that bred 34 x 1st as I stated I gave away.... free to a friend.

 

As for the website and my traits ,You have my sincere apologies Mr Bowler, as the site gets updated and the literture you require is not on there, so i shall tell you what I look for in the VDB colony,

 

The birds are medium/large build with strong shoulders and backs, large dome heads with top of head leading down to tip of beaks (a straight appearance), they carry the old wine or white coloured eye , except one cock i have.  the tail feather gives the view of one tail feather in width, soft silky feathering to the touch and a step in the most cases from primary flights to secondary flight in the wing, also performance with a pedigree as close to the original foundation birds of Karel Meulemans and Herman Beverdam as possible.

Also a resistance to disease with strong natural immunity.

 

Also when pairing they should have a relationship with their propective mates of a certain way. relationship to breeding and maintaining the lines through pairing. without declining the genepool to the extent of deterioration within the family, also selection to through culling and then racing.

 

 

hope this helps mate , thanks,

 

can you explain some of your breeding principles to me as i am curious of the methods used by anyone.

[OLDYELLOW]

 

Sorry mate you are totally wrong about footballers!! Like i say i've played with some very good lads, a couple in the same team as me, but its a natural talent, i agree they still have a lot to learn, if it was that easy they would'nt be getting paid the mega bucks they do as there would be a ronaldo on every street corner.

 

a baby boy cant kick a ball when born ? he cant even crawl or stand new born his genes hes been given by his parents determine that in nature there is no room for derormaty so weak / disabled birds get naturaly suppressed , but nature is a battle of survival , lets take a good footballer great fitness ectra but there just as likely to have a disabled child i can think of this senario without adding names , so your saying were all born to kick a man made object ? i suppose we all could actualy kick it but to control it and be able to be in good control takes skills which are learned , so we could take 2 boys in a race for instance one with head lice one with none who would win the race ? it wouldnt be a factor in the boy winning having head lice but it would be down to determination and applying themself into doing what they want to do , even if both applied themselves one would expect a result of a win or a draw or outright win , look at this dancing on ice non ice skaters as not intrested give them some tv time and money , there good skaters some could be proffesional

[Guest TIMBARRA LOFTS]

I still cant personally see what is wrong with pairing nestmates together, i wonder if someone who has never done it could tell me why they havent?

 

 

Chris or vallance, nobody has said there is anything wrong with pairing bro x sis. read the thread chris....  

 

 

[BLACK W F]

are nest mates not brother and sister  also some continental fanciers will put nest/mates bros/sisters together off there best cks paired to there best hens mostly for breeding

cheers Alan

[OLDYELLOW]

 

Nice comparison with the soup, genes when crossed can do all sorts, produce extroardinary exceptions, sometimes even in humans mass murderers!! But if you add a tomato soup to a tomato soup does it taste more tomatoey?

 

well lets also take a tomatoe bush each fruit although from the same tree can taste different some more watery some prone to infections some sweeter some bitter but same bush produced them all so alot of factors go in to the gene pool its getting the right ones together , so adding more tomotoe genes to the  gene pool can still produce a variety of tastes / blends  as did there parents

[Guest TIMBARRA LOFTS]

I still cant personally see what is wrong with pairing nestmates together, i wonder if someone who has never done it could tell me why they havent?

 

 

Chris or vallance, nobody has said there is anything wrong with pairing bro x sis. read the thread chris....  

 

 

[Guest]

a baby boy cant kick a ball when born ? he cant even crawl or stand new born his genes hes been given by his parents determine that in nature there is no room for derormaty so weak / disabled birds get naturaly suppressed , but nature is a battle of survival , lets take a good footballer great fitness ectra but there just as likely to have a disabled child i can think of this senario without adding names , so your saying were all born to kick a man made object ? i suppose we all could actualy kick it but to control it and be able to be in good control takes skills which are learned , so we could take 2 boys in a race for instance one with head lice one with none who would win the race ? it wouldnt be a factor in the boy winning having head lice but it would be down to determination and applying themself into doing what they want to do , even if both applied themselves one would expect a result of a win or a draw or outright win , look at this dancing on ice non ice skaters as not intrested give them some tv time and money , there good skaters some could be proffesional

:-/ PLEASE CAN YOU HELP ME TRAIN A PIGEON TO BE A GOOD BREEDER ;)HEAD LICE ;D ;D