PigeonDetective Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Im aware that whilst I was settling my older birds, Iv overfed them & their out of shape.. For the past couple of weeks iv cut their food down & been exercising them everyday with mixed results.. The older birds tend to sit on the roof of the house or the loft.. Im guessing because their hungry their waiting for the food to come.. But If I feed them more the day before they will take longer to trap and not want to fly! Its a hard balance to strike.. The day after bonfire night my old birds and youngsters were flying out all together starting to kit up.. I felt like I had made real progress.Then today only the odd bird felt like exercising! Iv ordered hormoform and tonic to add to their water, So I can restrict their diet further without worrying whether their getting enough nutrients.. Its early days, But progress seems slow.. Any advice on getting them performing how they should be would be much appreciated! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PigeonDetective Posted November 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Forgot to ask.. My young birds are much more keen to fly and im afraid of the older birds teaching them bad habits.. Are my older birds damaged goods? I don't really have room for birds who arnt pulling their weight, But if I can help rectify any mistakes that are my fault id like to avoid getting rid of them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIGEON_MAN Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 What sort of food are you feeding at the moment and how much per bird are you giving them. What sort of food are you feeding at the moment and how much per bird are you giving them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyleakin Lofts Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 During the moult they don't always want to fly, but more experienced guys on here will help you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy Burgess Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 What sort of food are you feeding at the moment and how much per bird are you giving them. What sort of food are you feeding at the moment and how much per bird are you giving them.also do you have a routine ? out at the same time ? in and fed at the same time ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnQuinn Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 During the moult they don't always want to fly, but more experienced guys on here will help you. I find that too, especially when on their last couple of flights. My lot are out whenever possible and they are only flying for 10 or 15 mins at a time which disnae rteally concern me. Handled a couple over the last week and they're in not bad shape for the show season, finding the time to get them to the shows is more difficult than getting them ready for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PigeonDetective Posted November 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Feeding them about an oz each of willsbridge maintenance, once a day after they have been let out..Usually let them out around 9.30 in the morning? Have only recently recently switched to this routine a couple of weeks ago though.. I was originally feeding them twice daily, mornings & evenings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiley Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Feeding them about an oz each of willsbridge maintenance, once a day after they have been let out..Usually let them out around 9.30 in the morning? Have only recently recently switched to this routine a couple of weeks ago though.. I was originally feeding them twice daily, mornings & evenings What is the composition of the grain? How many flights to go have the majority of birds got to drop? Feeding them after they have gone out means the birds are waiting 24 hrs before there next feed. If you would want them to exercise better, they would need a the bigger feed of the evening. When racing widowhood my pigeons exercise once a day, but because I want them to exercise well and they fly of an evening, they get a bigger quantity of grain in the morning , which makes them want to fly, but of the evening they have very little. Personally if you think there overweight, the homoform will do you no favours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex young Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Feeding them about an oz each of willsbridge maintenance, once a day after they have been let out..Usually let them out around 9.30 in the morning? Have only recently recently switched to this routine a couple of weeks ago though.. I was originally feeding them twice daily, mornings & eveningsMy routine is much the same as yours at the moment, 1oz of Versele Laga Mutine and out at 10-00am.The birds usually fly for only 20/25 mins but range and trap well on return.Give them a bit of time to get used to your routine because as it's already been said some birds don't like to fly when they're on the end flights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PigeonDetective Posted November 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 I initially started the one feed a day to drop weight, might revert back to morning and evening feed if they seem more keen to fly and trap.. The make up of the mix is Maize, Tic Beans, Wheat, Blue Green Peas, White/Yellow Peas, Barley and Red Dari.. Think their all done with the moult, maybe im just not giving them enough time to adjust to the new routine.. Added the tonic to their water today, Not that its going to be a miracle solution, but every little helps I suppose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiley Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 I initially started the one feed a day to drop weight, might revert back to morning and evening feed if they seem more keen to fly and trap.. The make up of the mix is Maize, Tic Beans, Wheat, Blue Green Peas, White/Yellow Peas, Barley and Red Dari.. Think their all done with the moult, maybe im just not giving them enough time to adjust to the new routine.. Added the tonic to their water today, Not that its going to be a miracle solution, but every little helps I suppose Quiet a high protein diet, pigeons don't exercise great with high levels of protein IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Novice Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 In my opinion there are no lazy pigeons. A pigeon which does not exercise at this time of year while separated suggests all is not well within. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bluemorning Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 you could try a small feed of barley in the morning followed by half a ounce of your normal feed in the afternoon with as much barley as they want to eat see how they perform in 2 weeks time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PigeonDetective Posted November 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Which grains can I cut out to lower the protein levels? So your assumptions are that my pigeons arnt well novice? you could try a small feed of barley in the morning followed by half a ounce of your normal feed in the afternoon with as much barley as they want to eat see how they perform in 2 weeks time. Will barley not put too much weight on them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiley Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Which grains can I cut out to lower the protein levels? So your assumptions are that my pigeons arnt well novice? Will barley not put too much weight on them? Barley is a great leveller, it's pigeons least favourite grain. When barley is in a good percentage of your mix, your birds will never be to heavy if fed correctly, If fed a little at a time, and any grain left after each handful, the birds receive no more , as they have had there fill. It's the best way to learn to feed for anyone new to the pigeon sport , or those who are unaware on what a pigeon needs. Regarding protein levels, Any beans or peas are high in protein. I'm not saying to cut protein out completely by the way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Owen Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 The thing that struck me was the remark that they go onto the roof. If I had birds that went onto the roof I would wait until they had moulted out and then discipline them until they understood that they are not allowed to do that. I simply wouldn't give them a grain of corn until they flew until I called and then trapped. Maybe 5 minutes at first but eventually an hour. When you start to teach them manners try to time your call to just before they want to land on the house. I have found that a dog trainer's clicker works well because you might show your annoyance in your voice whereas the clicker is always the same. When they are good and hungry give them something they really enjoy such as peanuts or trapping mix but only when they trap and never when they are in the loft. The treats are special and only ever a reward for trapping. The house and the roof of the loft must be forbidden territory at all times. Birds that get the idea that they will carry on behaving badly should either go into the Stock Loft or the bin. In regard to feeding, get them on barley on a once a day feed. Not that rubbish that some farms sell but good quality barley. Put oil on the barley every day and cinnamon powder. In my book there is only one thing worse than a badly behaved pigeon and that is a badly behaved dog. I am much to old and irritable to put up with either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIGEON_MAN Posted November 8, 2013 Report Share Posted November 8, 2013 I initially started the one feed a day to drop weight, might revert back to morning and evening feed if they seem more keen to fly and trap.. The make up of the mix is Maize, Tic Beans, Wheat, Blue Green Peas, White/Yellow Peas, Barley and Red Dari.. Think their all done with the moult, maybe im just not giving them enough time to adjust to the new routine.. Added the tonic to their water today, Not that its going to be a miracle solution, but every little helps I supposeIf their mostly through the moult I would change the feed to 100% barley,this will take off any extra weight they are carrying and they will fly well on it,you could if you want feed say 20%in the morning and the rest at night but personally mine just get one feed per day,but they very rarely get let out through the winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bluemorning Posted November 8, 2013 Report Share Posted November 8, 2013 Which grains can I cut out to lower the protein levels? So your assumptions are that my pigeons arnt well novice? Will barley not put too much weight on them? no mate barley is a good food for pigeons but as said they would prefer to other grains,this will help reduce any fat stored in the body and may improve loft flying but you have to wait a while for your new feeding to start to work it wont be sorted by the weekend,see if you can get a local pigeon man come and see your feeding and he may give you a good few tips ATB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwh Posted November 8, 2013 Report Share Posted November 8, 2013 Quiet a high protein diet, pigeons don't exercise great with high levels of protein IMOWhat makes you think they won't exercise on aHP diet ?We hopper fed beans and had a cracking season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiley Posted November 8, 2013 Report Share Posted November 8, 2013 What makes you think they won't exercise on aHP diet ?We hopper fed beans and had a cracking season Personally Dwh, mine prefere Daddies!!! On a serious note, it's my observation over the years with the birds when exercising, they don't exercise as well as birds on a lower protein percentage, I never mentioned how they raced on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blaz Posted November 8, 2013 Report Share Posted November 8, 2013 feed a high carb mix for week or 2 birds will soon fly the fat of Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PigeonDetective Posted November 8, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 8, 2013 Iv took onboard about feeding barley and rewarding good behaviour with trapping seed or peanuts as a treat.. They flew pretty keenly today, I think its a matter of fitness because the youngsters on the same diet are much keener to exercise.. Hopefully its just a matter of time until they all show willing.. Call me soft, but im not one for culling.. Any bad habits they've picked up are probably my fault.. Thanks for all the replies people Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bluemorning Posted November 8, 2013 Report Share Posted November 8, 2013 Iv took onboard about feeding barley and rewarding good behaviour with trapping seed or peanuts as a treat.. They flew pretty keenly today, I think its a matter of fitness because the youngsters on the same diet are much keener to exercise.. Hopefully its just a matter of time until they all show willing.. Call me soft, but im not one for culling.. Any bad habits they've picked up are probably my fault.. Thanks for all the replies people its good that you are honest with yourself,feeding and the correct amount of carbs fat etc is not easy ,what you could do is find yourself a good all round mix with as many different kind of corn and seeds high in protein so that it is good for breeding then barley and trapping mix to adjust protien and fat content this will help you learn quicker than swapping from mix to mix season by season as you learn by your results and mistakes, if you keep a written record then you can adjust your feeding to suit you and your birds, and because barley is not to expensive this will off set cost of the mix you buy as your main mix, what ever you decide i wish you and your birds every success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PigeonDetective Posted November 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2013 Thats a good idea blue morning.. I keep notes so I can hit the right balance.. Had bit of a nightmare this morning, from one extreme to the other.. Let them out as usual, flying great, best iv seen them, saw my young birds drifting further.. didnt panic to begin with.. 2 young an 2 old birds have gone out of sight.. which is great aslong as they know the area well enough.. still no sign Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PigeonDetective Posted November 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2013 Well 2 youngsters & 1 older bird back.. the one missing is one of the originals.. Last bird I lost was his mate ironically.. still time in good conditions with a bit of luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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