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Paratyphoid! Can it be stopped?


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http://www.wiseharmon.com/Stalosan_e/stalosan/poultry/articles.htm

Stalosan F for pigeons.

Stalosan F is one of the best-kept secrets from the pigeon fancier. I first started working with it in the intensive poultry world and quickly realised it also had an application for my pigeons. It is a unique powder disinfectant that is ideal for use as a loft powder being able to dry up damp patches, reduce smells and kill infectious organisms. Laboratory studies have shown that it will kill paramyxovirus, E.coli, salmonella, coccidia and worm eggs.

In this article I would like to review the background to disease problems and detail the trial work that has been completed with Stalosan F.

 

The Problem - sudden rapid build ups of infection

 

Young birds and old birds are more susceptible to infections. The mixed age groups that is the normal way for keeping the racing pigeon ensures that infection is present at low and inapparent levels throughout the year.

 

However, at specific times of the year this may change, most notably in the spring. The dampness, warmer days and the stress of breeding and rearing youngsters can be associated with a rapid build up of infection that results in disease.

 

The most familiar will be the respiratory (the "snots"), intestinal (coccidiosis) and mortality ("young bird sickness") problems that beset the youngster.

 

Survival of infection

 

The ability of infectious organisms to survive and develop in the environment varies with the particular organism.

 

The majority (viruses, bacteria, mycoplasma and Chlamydia) merely survive in droppings and respiratory exudates until they enter another susceptible pigeon.

 

Coccidial oocysts and worm eggs must undergo further development before they are able to successfully infect another bird.

 

The huge numbers of infectious organisms that may be present in one dropping - in excess of 20,000 coccidial oocysts to 100's of millions of bacteria and viruses, is the reason for their success.

 

 

 

 

Spread of infection from bird to bird

 

 

Infection is spread from bird to bird by many routes.

1.

Through the air - mycoplasma

 

2.

Through the water - E.coli

 

3.

Through the droppings - coccidia, worms.

 

4.

Through crop feeding - canker

 

5.

Through fighting - pigeon pox

 

6.

Through handling

 

 

 

If you can find a way to reduce that cross-infection then you have a good chance of preventing disease problems. Stalosan's safety factor allows the fancier to achieve that control.

 

Why does disease occur

 

Disease is the outward sign associated with uncontrolled infection. Your birds may become infected and affected without showing signs of disease. There are many factors involved that determine whether or not disease occurs. Some of these are listed below:-

 

 

 

1.

How infectious is the organism i.e. does it take one or many thousands of organisms to initiate disease.

 

2.

The level of environmental contamination.

 

3.

The humidity and temperature in the loft.

 

4.

The number of birds in each section.

 

 

 

The impact of disease

 

Disease can have varying effects from the annoying to the disastrous. Breeding performance can suffer, viability and growth of the young can be affected, feed and water intake is often reduced and performance, almost inevitably, will suffer. It goes without saying that there is also a cost implication to disease either in the form of replacement costs, treatment costs or additional rearing costs.

 

How Stalosan F works

 

Stalosan works as a disinfectant, killing many types of virus including parmyxoviruses, bacteria such as E.coli and Salmonella spp., mycoplasmas, coccidia and worm eggs. It also acts as a powerful drying agent and works to reduce the levels of ammonia and sulphur gases in the loft. All the key areas in loft management. We have trialled the product in our own lofts for nearly a year ( my partner Fred will not be without it now). Over this period I have regularly tested the dropping and the loft area for bacterial levels , coccidial oocysts and carried out regular worm egg counts. There is no doubt that regular use of Stalosan has maintained uniformly low levels ( less than 1000 oocysts/g faeces and no worm eggs ). As a result we have had fewer problems and had to spend less on medication. Our lofts are drier and smell much better and my colleague Fred is on the blower if we look like running out.

 

 

 

The benefits of using Stalosan F

 

1.

Dries up damp patches on the floor from watery droppings and spilt water

 

2.

Leaves a covering of powder over all the surfaces that the pigeons walk and perch on.

 

3.

Helps keep the atmosphere smelling fresher.

 

4.

Persists for several days to a week after it has been used regularly.

 

5.

Keeps the pigeons feet drier and cleaner.

 

6.

Reduces the challenge from infectious organisms particularly coccidia and worms.

 

7.

Reduces the reliance on medication to control coccidial and worm infections (our birds have not been treated for over a year) .

 

8.

Can be used with the birds in the loft.

 

9.

No adverse affects on the birds have been noticed in our loft after regular weekly usage for over a year.

 

10.

No respiratory signs seen as a result of sprinkling Stalosan F in the loft.

 

11.

No adverse affects on the plumage.

 

The birds can still be fed on the floor without problems.

 

 

 

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I will keep it quite short, but having been in consultation, with some vets over a year or two. I am led to believe that this is a serious, uncontrolable disease that can be within most of our birds without us knowing its  presence. The so called carriers, show no signs of sickness

  whatsoever, perfect looking, but pass it on when breeding commences.  This could even be part of the reason, why ybs are dropping like flies. Any comments most welcome.    

 

NAW!!!

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can it be stoped yes,  if you stop the mice  rats and strays  entering your loft,  its a tough ask,  but inoculation is the only way to control it, if not the birds are exposed to it in the baskets when held over ;) and this aint worth having  :X

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can it be stoped yes,  if you stop the mice  rats and strays  entering your loft,  its a tough ask,  but inoculation is the only way to control it, if not the birds are exposed to it in the baskets when held over ;) and this aint worth having  :X

 

Yes I agree you can control it but you will never stop it as it is rife in so many different forms :-/

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can remember back to the time when paramyxo came to these shore think it was back 82/83 and channel racing got suspended through ,the then shu held a meeting in motherwell civic centre to discuss the problem of para and held a vote to make it compulsary any how the shu vet at the time was a think called a guy called macrae and he stated then that when pigeons take para then in 99% of cases salmonella/paratyphoid is present and explained that to keep para at bay we should vaccinate them so what happens to the salmonella at this point it dont just dissapear ,in my understanding of vaccination is it builds up anti bodies in the blood to enable the pigeon to fight it of dont mean to say it wont take and in a way that might not be visible to the naked eye and remember when a foreign body is given to any animal its own immune system starts to work and attack it leaving it vurnable to other diseases in my opinion salmonella ?? ;)

 

 

The first immunerisation is all important... why once a month for the first three months is apparently really needed.

 

Know a good flyer that sold a pair of stock birds age 5 and 7 years old that went to Australia.

Never raced or what not, just bred for Stock.

One jab.

Wasn't allowed in Aussie land as the vaccine was still very prevalent.

So long story short, I question the jab every year approach... and enhance the 3 times within their first threemonths.

 

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Yes I agree you can control it but you will never stop it as it is rife in so many different forms :-/

 

yes i agree, this can be controlled to some extent, by keeping the loft rodent free as poss, i,e by leaving no grain around at all , even at this ,,you will still get the odd one or two at times , really a case of trying to keep the loft and surroundings as  rodent free as  is possible , but allthough rats and mice can be a very bad source for this desease, off course there are many other causes , i find ,as advised by my vet , that virkon s.  is another of the disenfectants , that have been approved by defra , i have found since using this i have had no desease at all [this covers all deseases] i honestly cant speak highly  enough of this ,and allthough i know that  any desease can creep in at any time , i have certainly had no problems since using this product, any questions about this product ,you can e,mail   biosecurity@gbc.dupont.com, or find out more about this product    www.virkons.com

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I have just replied by pm to two of our guys, offering advice, one of the guys having had a bad experience himself on the subject. I will let everybody know, the products that I have been advised to use, later on.      I was told previously,  that the only solution, (to save time and money) was a "full cull" procedure.  Fair enough, But what will happen when replacement birds share the same baskets as the carriers? Surely this is a no win situation, a vicious circle to say the least!

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Two things Vic; (1) your post infers that pigeons have no resistance against salmonella. If that were true, there'd be no pigeons, so some must have resistance bred into them - and some bred-out  or (mis)managed-out?

 

(2) Had picked up salmonella and e. coli were related. This is part of an article I'd copied to my computer and forgotten about.  :) Google brought it up.  :)

 

This is part of an article comes from notes taken during a seminar given by Dr. Steve Weir at the 1993 AU convention. Updated by Dr. Weir March 16 1999 For the I.F. home page. Dr. Weir is a small animal veterinarian in Catoosa Oklahoma. He has flown pigeons successfully for many years and helps pigeon flyers from around the country with health problems.

 

Paratyphoid: Salmonella causes the disease paratyphoid in pigeons. It is a bacterial infection that causes a multitude of possible symptoms including sudden death of apparently healthy birds of any age, joint infections causing a dropped wing or lameness, infertility in cocks and hens, diarrhea, weight loss, etc, etc.

 

E. coli: This is a related bacteria to Salmonella and PRODUCES THE EXACT SAME SYMPTOMS. It is much more common than salmonella and probably a lot of what people are diagnosing as salmonella based on symptoms alone is actually E. coli infection. You treat E. coli with antibiotics but you should have a culture and sensitivity run before you treat as this bug varies a lot in what drug kills it best. I have made vaccines for some lofts with chronic problems and helped them, but this is not usually needed. E. coli is a big secondary invader and birds that are stressed with worms, coccidia, canker, and other problems tend to be much more susceptible to it. If you have had E. coli problems in the past it is critical that you control all other disease problems to keep it from recurring.

 

Wasn't aware they could be confused like this?

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Thanks IB and to the guys who have been in touch by pm. As I mentioned previously, these are some of the products that have been recommended to halt the progress of paratyphoid. I only hope this information may help somebody out. A 14 day treatment of Dicural worked wonders for one guy.  While another suggests using Parastop in tablet form along with Belgafox in the water. These last two two products can be obtained from D.Werdt. Thanks again. Vic.

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I will keep it quite short, but having been in consultation, with some vets over a year or two. I am led to believe that this is a serious, uncontrolable disease that can be within most of our birds without us knowing its  presence. The so called carriers, show no signs of sickness

  whatsoever, perfect looking, but pass it on when breeding commences.  This could even be part of the reason, why ybs are dropping like flies. Any comments most welcome.    

 

Vic, yes, all lofts have paratyphoid/salmonella. Avian veterinarians here have demonstrated that you can actually eliminate the carrier state in pigeons by a full 14 days of Baytril in conjunction with Sal-Bac vaccination. Vaccination with Sal-Bac should take place about the 7th day of the treatment with Baytril -- not before. Baytril (Enrofloxacin) is the ONLY drug that will eliminate the carrier state of salmonella in pigeons. It can be controlled by a preseason round of something like Parastop followed by vaccination, but this will not eliminate the on-going carrier problem.

 

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Thanks Larry, I have always respected your opinions since the early pipa days. I will be sending you a pm in the very near future, because if I want "shut" of carriers,  What you say sounds good. Cheers, Vic.

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Vic, yes, all lofts have paratyphoid/salmonella. Avian veterinarians here have demonstrated that you can actually eliminate the carrier state in pigeons by a full 14 days of Baytril in conjunction with Sal-Bac vaccination. Vaccination with Sal-Bac should take place about the 7th day of the treatment with Baytril -- not before. Baytril (Enrofloxacin) is the ONLY drug that will eliminate the carrier state of salmonella in pigeons. It can be controlled by a preseason round of something like Parastop followed by vaccination, but this will not eliminate the on-going carrier problem.

 

with due respect larry, this sounds good in eliminating the carrier state of paratyphoid in a pigeon [which could save a lot of pigeons and lesson a problem], but allthough my  question might seem  a bit silly, [its not meant to be :)] could this carrier state in the pigeon,, now [say] cured by baytrill and vaccination [sal-bac] , become a carrier again ?? at any other time ,,,,,  or once being a carrier and cured , will be immune to catching this again ??

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with due respect larry, this sounds good in eliminating the carrier state of paratyphoid in a pigeon [which could save a lot of pigeons and lesson a problem], but allthough my  question might seem  a bit silly, [its not meant to be :)] could this carrier state in the pigeon,, now [say] cured by baytrill and vaccination [sal-bac] , become a carrier again ?? at any other time ,,,,,  or once being a carrier and cured , will be immune to catching this again ??

 

i also heard that u have to at least vaccinate for 4 year after the course of baytrill to cure it

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Vic, yes, all lofts have paratyphoid/salmonella.

 

Rather a sweeping statement that, Larry, given that salmonella generally is considered a pathogen, and a zoonotic one at that (ie an animal disease that can also cause illness and death in humans).

 

It is also considered not to be a normal gut inhabitant, so  given your statement, why e.g. have independant droppings tests of my own birds not shown salmonella infection? Is there a specific test for it? I also note no UK Pigeon Press adverts specifically offering salmonella tests for racing pigeons, due perhaps to there being no market need for it in the first place?

 

I do not recall its widespread presence in pigeons ever being reported on this Site either, and given that it is zoonotic, no widespread reports of pigeon fanciers becoming ill with it either, (I would expect at least a few cases) and these cases in turn (because they were zoonotic) would be picked up by our UK Health Protection Agencies, these in turn reporting to and sparking action by UK Animal Health Agencies, DEFRA etc.

 

Given that droppings may harbour a dangerous pathogen, what safety measures would you suggest for those on here who do their own droppings tests?

 

 

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Yes! Plenty of good comments, But it seems to me, that most of us of, along with the vets don't really know the score.  I may be well out, but I think this all started years ago when we succombed to the MAFF and started the vaccination procedure. I also believe that in the last few years, this Paratyphoid, whatever, call it what you like! has moved to an area that affects the very essence of pigeon racing. THE ABILITY TO HOME. Never, have I ever witnessed so many losses, as the majority of fanciers suffered this year, cosidering the weather was on our side most weeks.  Why don't pigeons turn up next day as  they did in the past? Simply because they have lost  the magical "Who knows What?"  that makes them racing pigeons. This is my opinion, and I could be miles away from the true cause. Could in the end to have something to do with electronics. BUT MARK VICS WORDS, THERE IS SOMETHING ALIEN WITHIN MOST OF OUR BIRDS THESE DAYS. SAD BUT TRUE, ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.

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in reading vic,s last post i must say i agree with him entirely,, maybe harsh sounding but nevertheless true ,,most ordinary vets know  less than some   fanciers about pigeons , and ,really just make money by giving a prescription for x amount of birds with x amount of medicine [usually a common broad spectrum antibiotic] any pigeon fancier must deal with a really top avian vet with pigeon experience

i also beleive a lot of problems have arisen since we started paramyxo vaccination [and there seems no going back the way now]

this paratypoid [allthough been with us a long time] with lots of new medication and the paramyxo vacine ,,,,to my mind , would have to have mutated in some way or form through the years ,, god only knows of which form.or even forms,,," their ability to home "or their magical" whatever" that makes them into racing pigeons , has most definately diminished in the last 20 years ,and more apparent in the last 5 years but,,,still getting worse year by year, i certainly dont know the answer ,, i still feel like its a big jigsaw puzzle , we can fit some small peices together as to some reasons , but feel theres a big chunk missing alltogether ,and if we dont find it , i just wonder what will become of pigeon racing in 20 years time,,,,,and have to repeat,,"  but mark  vics words , there is something alien within most of our birds  these days"

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Never be eradicated. Like the articles I posted before... Fanciers will continue to treat for Ecoli, or anything else willy nilly. So that in it's self means that your birds will often be in contact with other birds that are infected.

Now, again, a mild infection (Like a Jab) often means that that bird won't show any ill effects, but could well soon be a carrier... Even again.

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i remember a few pigeon forums at the start of this breeding season saying there young were dying in the nest blaming the nest felts as the cause

maybe it was paratyphoid/salmonella as the cause

 

How very true.... And I remember a few shooting me down for suggesting such a thing! But that of course meant I can back stronger.

Indeed I was side swiped, even had a one or two stating reasons why I was talking rot and held it to ridicule. I email the persons(s) seeking advice directly and voiced my views.

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Rather a sweeping statement that, Larry, given that salmonella generally is considered a pathogen, and a zoonotic one at that (ie an animal disease that can also cause illness and death in humans).

 

It is also considered not to be a normal gut inhabitant, so  given your statement, why e.g. have independant droppings tests of my own birds not shown salmonella infection? Is there a specific test for it? I also note no UK Pigeon Press adverts specifically offering salmonella tests for racing pigeons, due perhaps to there being no market need for it in the first place?

 

I do not recall its widespread presence in pigeons ever being reported on this Site either, and given that it is zoonotic, no widespread reports of pigeon fanciers becoming ill with it either, (I would expect at least a few cases) and these cases in turn (because they were zoonotic) would be picked up by our UK Health Protection Agencies, these in turn reporting to and sparking action by UK Animal Health Agencies, DEFRA etc.

 

Given that droppings may harbour a dangerous pathogen, what safety measures would you suggest for those on here who do their own droppings tests?

 

 

IB, that is the statement to me by the head avian veterinarian at the University of Minnesota. That is his observation about the matter in the USA and pigeons. Perhaps it is different in the UK, but I doubt it. I would grant that an exception might exist for someone who has eliminated the bacteria from his/her loft; keeps biohazard protocol; does not race; does not introduce new pigeons, and does not allow anyone into their lofts who keeps pigeons. If you race the bacteria will be introduced to your loft at some point -- but it is probably already there is a latent state. Unless someone develops a super pigeon, every loft will deal with cases of paratyphoid, herpes virus, adenovirus, etc., etc. if they race pigeons. Regarding your droppings test: such a test is better than nothing, but it will only show the bacteria when the birds are actually shedding the microorganism due to stress, other illness, etc. Post-mortem is much more accurate as is blood test when illness is evident.

 

I find it very odd that paratyphoid is a reportable disease in the UK as Salmonella typhimurium var. copenhagen is not transmittable to humans under normal circumstances. The association of avian veterinarians in the USA only notes one bacterium common to pigeons that holds significant potential to infect humans: Chlamydia. Certain avian flu viruses hold the potential, but it has been demonstrated by double blind studies at the University of California Davis that pigeons are not a good vector for most avian flu viruses. Perhaps you breed superbugs in the UK! ;D ;D On the precautionary side as you note above, I would suggest that any fancier wear a mask in their loft no matter how healthy their pigeons may be due to problems associated with pigeon dust (pigeon fancier's lung). I don't think extreme precautionary measures are necessary as pigeons do not shed the bacterium continuously, and even when they do Salmonella typhimurium var. copenhagen is not a significant health risk to humans.

 

Vic, I would disagree that the problem was introduced by vaccinating as the problem preceded any vaccination mandate. If you want to find a culprit on which to pin problems like ybs look to Circovirus I and II.

 

 

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i remember a few pigeon forums at the start of this breeding season saying there young were dying in the nest blaming the nest felts as the cause

maybe it was paratyphoid/salmonella as the cause

 

It was the black nestfelts, no doubt about it.

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with due respect larry, this sounds good in eliminating the carrier state of paratyphoid in a pigeon [which could save a lot of pigeons and lesson a problem], but allthough my  question might seem  a bit silly, [its not meant to be :)] could this carrier state in the pigeon,, now [say] cured by baytrill and vaccination [sal-bac] , become a carrier again ?? at any other time ,,,,,  or once being a carrier and cured , will be immune to catching this again ??

 

Jimmy, yes, any pigeon that is cured of the carrier state can be re-introduced to Salmonella if an annual booster vaccination is not done after the initial cure, or if the vaccine does not work. It is not a 100 percent guarantee, but it is more effective than anything else that is currently available. Quite a few years ago I inadvertently introduced a paratyphoid infection into my lofts when I brought in some new breeders. They had been vaccinated for everything (so I was told) so after a few weeks I introduced them to the breeding loft. They looked picture perfect. Guess what happened during the second round of eggs?. So I ran the entire flock through the process again. These days any new bird to my loft is quarantined, treated for 14 days with Baytril and vaccinated no matter who I get the bird from. No problems since. Works for me, anyway. Others do it differently.

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The bit I cant get my head around is a carrier must have built up antibodies not to succumb to the full blown effects of Paratyphoid, by giving it a course of Baytril the Paratyphoid will be eliminated from the pigeon but surly the antibodies will remain. So my question is why vaccinate as the antibodies to fight this are already in place. :-/

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The bit I cant get my head around is a carrier must have built up antibodies not to succumb to the full blown effects of Paratyphoid, by giving it a course of Baytril the Paratyphoid will be eliminated from the pigeon but surly the antibodies will remain. So my question is why vaccinate as the antibodies to fight this are already in place. :-/

 

The antibodies in some pigeons can help them hold their own potential infection at bay, but the antibodies cannot prevent the carrier from shedding the bacteria. Not all exposed pigeons become carriers, but a bird is a carrier will infect other pigeons at some point. It seems to happen most often during the second round of eggs during breeding season.

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Am I right in thinking that by vaccinating your actually introducing a small enough dose of Paratyphoid into the pigeon to stimulates the body into producing antibodies to fight it off should it come into contact with it at a later date. A carrier pigeon will already have these antibodies so once the course of Baytril has done its work and rid the body of Paratyphoid I cant see whats to be gained by vaccinating. The antibodies are already in place.

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