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 dogeon |
| November 10, 2008, 3:52pm |
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Posts: 451
Gender:  Female
Location: worcestershire
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One wise man  & one of the best things one can spend their money on etc, before buying all those goodies  is a microscope & then learn how to use it. Enjoy.
totally agree i lost out on a good season for not knowing what was wrong, you have to wait for the droppings test, when the main things you can see yourself with a scope, and not resulting in treating blind |
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| smudger1964 |
| November 10, 2008, 4:04pm |
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Posts: 71
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This system contains all you need to knowto keep your birds in perfecthealth without which you will not win races. I will not bore you with pages of bullshit but get straight to the point. STEP 1 should be carried out with old birds as well as youngsters at least a month to six weeks before racing starts. Vaccination againest paratyphoid/salmonella. this illness is very hard to detect. The pigeons look look OK, train OK but are justthat yard behind the winners. A top Belgian vet has stated that 95% of lofts world wide have this disease in their lofts without knowing it. They have what are known as carriers, you will not get any good results until this disease is eleminated or kept under control. That is a fact, get them vaccinatednow!! (TRIMETHOPRIM) followed by 5 days withwith any good probiotic and multivit mixed together. after 5 days vaccinate all birds followed by 2 days probiotic and vitamins. STEP 2 One week to ten days after vaccination treat for canker. we use metronidazole  tablets. make sure any tablets used are200mg not 500mg, cut the tablet into four quarters and use one quarter per day for three days only. please note we give a quarter of a tablet every third week when racing old and young. Do not forget any canker treatment use multivits at any time during the racing season, please note that we do nottreat for cocci as in our food for rasing we use chicken layer pellets which containan anticocci stat. STEP3 worms, we always treat for worms with mediworm a very good product. one tablet per bird. Always leave approximately one week between treatments. STEP4 is the treatment for respitory diseasewe treat for five to seven days with doxycycline. The product we use is lased with with multivits so no need for any vits after treatment We use 'doxy' every three to four weeks when racing for two days alternate with canker treatment, one week after return from racetreat for canker the next day, we always use on Sunday and Monday. STEP5 Is the most important of all. Why do birds lose the edge after a decent result or two? Well the big problem is 9 times out of 10 is fungal or thrush as it is known. unless you treat this for five days you will not get your birds back in racing condition. Fungal problems are mainly brought on by the abuse of antibiotics. We would urge you to use Medistatin which is our preferred treatment for fungal/candida problems. No treatment= crap results!! Simple as that. The nystatin powder we use is the one made specifically for pigeons in the world, good stuff. We use every four weeks ,only if your pigeons are coming ok and our among the prizes treat every six weeks. use this system as stated and if you have any decent pigeons you will be amongst the prizes most weeks (FACT) Our feeding system is quite simple we always use diet200 on a morning, never depuritive,1/2 oz per bird and Versa Laga Super Widowhood Plus on a night 1 oz approximately.4 x 12 mile training tosses every week for the firast six weeks then 2 a week for the rest of the season. Stick it to it never change (sprint racing only) cider vineger twice per week oregostim in water (good stuff). Stick to the system details for top results. STEP6 is our super boost feed for Thursday and Friday morning when racing. Mix a small bag of Homaform(1/2oz per bird), a small bag of golden boost(old hand) 4 bags of ricelong grained from the super market, plus 1 small bag of conditioner (natural) mix all of this together and feed as stated. They will be off like rockets! I guarentee if you stick to this sysem 100% top results will come your way. GOOD LUCK HOPE THIS HELPS YOU OUT MATE MY DAD GOT IT FROM SOMEONE CALLED JR AND AS YOU SAW IT WORKED FOR HIM ALSO IN THOSE 3 RACES HE HAD BIRDS IN THE FED AND COMBINE SO IT DEFINATELY WORKS LET ME KNOW WAT YOU THINK OF IT
what a crock of sh** i did this system two years ago on twelve birds my results were crap compared to the other twelve that had no antis and would not advise any one puting that ammount of antibiotics into there birds your just putting there amuinity down for worser things to get in (para, selmenella) |
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| lenwadebob |
| November 10, 2008, 4:13pm |
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Posts: 558
Gender:  Male
Location: Lenwade, Norfolk
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Well said .................. these articles need sanctioning especially as there are young fanciers and novices on here |
|  THE FUTURE OF OUR SPORT DEPENDS ON YOU ........... TAKE A YOUNG PERSON UNDER YOUR WING |
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| smudger1964 |
| November 10, 2008, 4:36pm |
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Posts: 71
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| jacksafc |
| November 10, 2008, 4:48pm |
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Posts: 148
Location: SUNDERLAND
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Eloquently put smudger.
But i dare bet most top flyers use a system not far removed from the one in question.
As far as immunity goes these birds only have this regime for what? 14 weeks a year, if they get treated every 4 weeks on Doxy say, thats 6 days plus the 5 days at the start of the season, say 2 weeks overall, if you include cocci and canker thats 6 weeks from 52, 11%, does that really cause immunity problems,.
Although veterinary testing is probably best i've never been sure what it can determine apart from the obvious worms, cocci and canker, I've read that Para doesnt always show and not sure if respiratory problems can be detected.
Blanket treating has been used for years and although frowned upon by many "new age" fanciers it fits the bill.
Just a thought. |
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| smudger1964 |
| November 10, 2008, 5:11pm |
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Posts: 71
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Eloquently put smudger.
But i dare bet most top flyers use a system not far removed from the one in question.
As far as immunity goes these birds only have this regime for what? 14 weeks a year, if they get treated every 4 weeks on Doxy say, thats 6 days plus the 5 days at the start of the season, say 2 weeks overall, if you include cocci and canker thats 6 weeks from 52, 11%, does that really cause immunity problems,.
Although veterinary testing is probably best i've never been sure what it can determine apart from the obvious worms, cocci and canker, I've read that Para doesnt always show and not sure if respiratory problems can be detected.
Blanket treating has been used for years and although frowned upon by many "new age" fanciers it fits the bill.
Just a thought.
I Would say that any ammuinity would be down if having antis, therefore being on a transporter with infected birds or carriers would put your birds at risk during race season, if treating with antis during race season, respirtory can be heard with a trained ear and eye the main point is that viruses, bacteria and other things get use to antis so are less afective anyway its probably the new age fanciers that cause so much birds losses due to illness and spreading illness |
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| pigeon82 |
| November 10, 2008, 5:45pm |
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i just wanna help the novices
Posts: 121
Gender: Male
Location: NORTHERN IRELAND
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i aint insulting noone u r and as for some people it works my advice is try it you never no obviously it wont work for everyone but it gives people different ideas and theories |
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| pigeon82 |
| November 10, 2008, 5:50pm |
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i just wanna help the novices
Posts: 121
Gender: Male
Location: NORTHERN IRELAND
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im not saying you didnt try the system but at least its on here for others to read if u look further up the page alot of others are interested good advice passed on to people thats wat i say |
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| just ask me |
| November 10, 2008, 5:53pm |
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Posts: 1,026
Gender: Male
Location: in my loft
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afraid to say lads but all top flyer's are using a system like this or very close too it |
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| smudger1964 |
| November 10, 2008, 5:53pm |
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Posts: 71
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YOU CAN GIVE ADVICE BUT CAN'T MAKE AN APPOLIGY FOR WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT ME, SAYS IT ALL |
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| pigeon82 |
| November 10, 2008, 5:54pm |
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i just wanna help the novices
Posts: 121
Gender: Male
Location: NORTHERN IRELAND
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thank you just ask me just trying to put the point across trying to help others |
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| dogeon |
| November 10, 2008, 5:56pm |
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Posts: 451
Gender: Female
Location: worcestershire
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afraid to say lads but all top flyer's are using a system like this or very close too it
not all top flyers lol  |
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| just ask me |
| November 10, 2008, 5:59pm |
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Posts: 1,026
Gender: Male
Location: in my loft
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not all top flyers lol
id say 99% are using a system very close and they do medicate during the racing season |
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| smudger1964 |
| November 10, 2008, 6:01pm |
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Posts: 71
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YOU CAN GIVE ADVICE BUT CAN'T MAKE AN APPOLIGY FOR WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT ME, SAYS IT ALL
ARE YOU GOING TO ANSWER TO THIS THREAD |
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| supersonic steptoe |
| November 10, 2008, 8:04pm |
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Posts: 36
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your very right to be worried, all we hear now on pigeons is the next medications being used |
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| WulDon |
| November 10, 2008, 8:29pm |
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Posts: 220
Gender: Male
Location: dundee
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the lad is only trying to give some sound advise which has been tested and proven!
i'll bet if u asked your top flyers from around the UK they are all using a form of system not far from the quoted above to obtain not just results but super performances that most of us dream about.
i understand the concern about lowering the immune system of the pigeon, now a days does it really matter as we dont see many pigeons on the results from inland racing over 3 year old now, so in my opinion go for it in a sensible approach and win as much as you could from them before you are wiped out by either poor race conditions, clashing or the dreaded raptor problem!... only my opinion. |
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| IB |
| November 10, 2008, 8:39pm |
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Posts: 1,092
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As far as immunity goes these birds only have this regime for what? 14 weeks a year, if they get treated every 4 weeks on Doxy say, thats 6 days plus the 5 days at the start of the season, say 2 weeks overall, if you include cocci and canker thats 6 weeks from 52, 11%, does that really cause immunity problems,.
Blanket treating has been used for years and although frowned upon by many "new age" fanciers it fits the bill.
The treatment you describe is to medicate where illness is not apparent. No antibiotic has a 100% kill-rate. Those few thousand? bacteria that survive are immune to that antibiotic. In addition, they are immune to that whole class of antibiotics. In 24/48 hours they are also likely to be back at the same level as before the antibiotic was given, the difference being that every one of the new lot is antibiotic-resistant. And they are able to swop genes with other like bacteria making those bacteria immune to that whole class of antibiotics too. All this after one dose. Yes blanket treatment with antibiotics has gone on for years in lots of places - not just pigeons, but in farming, health services etc and has led to the rise of superbugs in hospitals e.g. C. diff, MRSA and strains of antibiotic-resistant canker in pigeons. Bugs are becoming resistant faster than new antibiotics can be produced. 'New age' is perhaps an appropriate term, no doubt you perhaps meant it otherwise. It means knowledge and understanding of the consequence of our actions. |
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| jacksafc |
| November 10, 2008, 9:02pm |
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Posts: 148
Location: SUNDERLAND
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Eloquently put smudger.
But i dare bet most top flyers use a system not far removed from the one in question.
As far as immunity goes these birds only have this regime for what? 14 weeks a year, if they get treated every 4 weeks on Doxy say, thats 6 days plus the 5 days at the start of the season, say 2 weeks overall, if you include cocci and canker thats 6 weeks from 52, 11%, does that really cause immunity problems,.
Although veterinary testing is probably best i've never been sure what it can determine apart from the obvious worms, cocci and canker, I've read that Para doesnt always show and not sure if respiratory problems can be detected.
Blanket treating has been used for years and although frowned upon by many "new age" fanciers it fits the bill.
Just a thought.
I recently re started 3 years ago after about a 15 year break and although the 2 days a week thing wasn't common knowledge it was still usual to blanket treat all birds with the same medication used nowadays and often to treat mid season as a precaution. I imagine that while most discuss the rights and wrongs of routine medication a lot of the top men have movd on and are years ahead of this. |
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| just ask me |
| November 10, 2008, 9:06pm |
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Posts: 1,026
Gender: Male
Location: in my loft
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well said and id say 99% of all top class fanicers use something along this lines |
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| jacksafc |
| November 10, 2008, 9:16pm |
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Posts: 148
Location: SUNDERLAND
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I probably agree with medicating only when neccessary but in real terms all fanciers dont have acces to an avian veterinarian and how many times a tear would this testing be needed.
In the past we used to send dropping samples to specialist pigeon vets who would advise treating for worms, canker etc but in the case of respiratory infections etc its not so easily diagnosed by a novice fancier and blanket teatments remove some of he doubt.
Anyway this is digresing from the original thread which i thought was intersting and helpful. |
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