Welcome to the Pigeonbasics Forum! We would like to welcome you to our community and invite you to register an account or login. Being a registered member is important, as it gives you several advantages over the normal Guest status. After registering you will be able to download files and images, post messages, and access member-only portions of the forum - just to name a few. Registration is quick and simple, and only takes about a minute of your time.
DONT EVER EVER MIX CHEMICALS I WORK WITH THEM EVERY DAY AND I KNOW SOMEONE WHO LOST HIS EYES AFTER HE MIXED 2 TOGETHER AND THEY REACTED SO TAKE CARE AND DONT DO IT!!!
vic,a large percentage of liverpool lofts have been vacinating against paratyphoid for a number of years now,those that have not seen its full affect on the birds probly think a bit of scaremongering goes on i think . its not a nice thing to see. hope your birds get back to full health soon mate. jimmy
Thanks Jim for your remarks on the issue at hand. But I honestly do not think that the Paratyphoid vaccination was not as prevalent as you may think. I would venture to say, that perhaps only 2% of Merseyside fliers injected, and these were only, because that they bought the dual purpose two Para solutions in the one phial. Where and how did my birds become infected? Simply from the remaining 98% who hadn't used the combi solution. Vic.
Hi you guys. As regarding which probiotic I decided to use! Throughout the last few years I have been buying some additives from the USA, including what is called a Vita pro Combi mix of pro biotics. This is now being sold in the Uk @ £6.50 per sachet which should, normally last half a season at least. Does Dr. Larry think that by using this, I am still on the right lines. Incidentally the water turns yelow on application, as most "cures" do.
sorry not been keeping on this thread. My guy at the Uni who is working on Chicken Salmonella said the best way is to use Virkon s as a disinfectant on th eloft and then burn it dry. Keep all utensils as clean as possible. He says there is no way of eradicating this as there are so many carriers, he says that it is best to cull any showing signs. Vaccination will only cover that variant of salmonella so what is the point of vaccinating when we dont know what strain we get.
On another note has anyone or does anyone use colostrum or beastings??? probably best probiotic known to the animal kingdom
sorry not been keeping on this thread. My guy at the Uni who is working on Chicken Salmonella said the best way is to use Virkon s as a disinfectant on th eloft and then burn it dry. Keep all utensils as clean as possible. He says there is no way of eradicating this as there are so many carriers, he says that it is best to cull any showing signs. Vaccination will only cover that variant of salmonella so what is the point of vaccinating when we dont know what strain we get.
On another note has anyone or does anyone use colostrum or beastings??? probably best probiotic known to the animal kingdom
sorry not been keeping on this thread. My guy at the Uni who is working on Chicken Salmonella said the best way is to use Virkon s as a disinfectant on th eloft and then burn it dry. Keep all utensils as clean as possible. He says there is no way of eradicating this as there are so many carriers, he says that it is best to cull any showing signs. Vaccination will only cover that variant of salmonella so what is the point of vaccinating when we dont know what strain we get.
On another note has anyone or does anyone use colostrum or beastings??? probably best probiotic known to the animal kingdom
If you know anyone with cattle try and get some milk from them off cow just before or just after they calved cant beat it for colostrum
Basically Alf its the first milk that comes from animals when they have just had their offspring it provides the young with all the nutrients and immunity needed in early life.
Frank Tasker uses it
I get it freeze it into cubes and place one in a drinker once a week
Surely we have our own pigeon colostrum? Pigeon milk. Does exactly the same thing except better, made by pigeons, for pigeons.
Research papers on it suggest that it's the most nutritious feed on the planet, and recommend it be fed to poultry?
On a more specific note: the pigeons have this from birth. If their immune system cannot cope after their own seeding with their own colostrum, then as Johny11's Uni guy suggests, and other sources I've already quoted also suggest, its not cow's colostrum etc that sick birds should be given, they should be culled - that is a proven way to stamp out disease.
By John Kazmierczak, DVM PrimaLac is a probiotic that has been in commercial and private use for several years. It has proved useful in control and prevention of several diseases in poultry, among which are E.coli and Salmonella infections. Other benefits are enhanced growth, better feed digestion and utilization, along with better feather quality. PrimaLac stands out from other probiotics because universities and other qualified research facilities have tested, documented, and demonstrated its usefulness and health benefits. Also, it has been shown to withstand extremes in temperature and humidity and remains stable up to a year after its container is opened. Its unique formulation ensures that a large portion of what is ingested actually gets into the bowel or GI tract and is not destroyed in the crop or stomach. Therefore, its desired effect is achieved. It is worthwhile to mention what a “probiotic” is. Probiotic is a term which means “for life”. Probiotics such as PrimaLac are live sources of friendly bacteria that are ingested as a supplemental aid to promote health, growth, and disease resistance. PrimaLac’s desired effect is achieved through adding it to the drinking water. The mechanism of action is to crowd out the bad bacteria, i.e., E. coli or Salmonella and occupy the lining of the intestinal tract (bowel). It also enhances bowel function by promoting a healthy bowel lining to promote absorption of nutrients, produce immunoglobulins (proteins used to fight disease) and make the bowel slightly more acid. Bad bacteria such as E. coli and Salmonella don’t thrive in acid environments. It’s little wonder the use of probiotics is found to be beneficial to help our pigeons ward off disease. In choosing a probiotic, be sure to check the label for the type and amount of organisms present to insure stability of the product, especially in extreme temperatures or extreme environmental conditions. Also, it should have been tested by a university or qualified researcher to document its usefulness. There are many probiotics for sale and one should carefully look for background data before purchasing for efficacy. In my own loft of several hundred pigeons, I have noticed many definite, beneficial effects from using PrimaLac for over a year: • Young bird mortality after weaning is almost “zero”. This has not happened in the past. • Fertility improved, there were less clear eggs, and the young birds grew and developed well. • No young birds developed Adeno, Circo, Pox, or Herpes viral infections for the first time ever. In the past, despite Pox vaccination, some birds always developed “Pox sores” or lesions. • There were fewer young bird losses in training and racing. • Fewer pigeons developed E. coli or Salmonella infections. • Overall feather quality improved. • Droppings are round and firm. • PrimaLac can be used with vitamins and most other supplements. • PrimaLac can be put in the bath water. • PrimaLac can be used with canker and coccidia medicines. • Antibiotic usage decreased, thus reducing the development of resistant strains of bacteria and lowering the cost of antibiotic use. • Feed consumption decreased. I have found it an especially useful disease preventative in damp, cold and hot, humid weather, where bacterial and yeast infections thrive. In-depth discussions with several fanciers have indicated that they too felt it was quite beneficial as a health aid for their pigeons. Overall, I have observed no negative side effects from its use, and feel it is a real benefit to help keep our pigeons healthy.
By John Kazmierczak, DVM PrimaLac is a probiotic that has been in commercial and private use for several years. It has proved useful in control and prevention of several diseases in poultry, among which are E.coli and Salmonella infections. Other benefits are enhanced growth, better feed digestion and utilization, along with better feather quality. PrimaLac stands out from other probiotics because universities and other qualified research facilities have tested, documented, and demonstrated its usefulness and health benefits. Also, it has been shown to withstand extremes in temperature and humidity and remains stable up to a year after its container is opened. Its unique formulation ensures that a large portion of what is ingested actually gets into the bowel or GI tract and is not destroyed in the crop or stomach. Therefore, its desired effect is achieved. It is worthwhile to mention what a “probiotic” is. Probiotic is a term which means “for life”. Probiotics such as PrimaLac are live sources of friendly bacteria that are ingested as a supplemental aid to promote health, growth, and disease resistance. PrimaLac’s desired effect is achieved through adding it to the drinking water. The mechanism of action is to crowd out the bad bacteria, i.e., E. coli or Salmonella and occupy the lining of the intestinal tract (bowel). It also enhances bowel function by promoting a healthy bowel lining to promote absorption of nutrients, produce immunoglobulins (proteins used to fight disease) and make the bowel slightly more acid. Bad bacteria such as E. coli and Salmonella don’t thrive in acid environments. It’s little wonder the use of probiotics is found to be beneficial to help our pigeons ward off disease. In choosing a probiotic, be sure to check the label for the type and amount of organisms present to insure stability of the product, especially in extreme temperatures or extreme environmental conditions. Also, it should have been tested by a university or qualified researcher to document its usefulness. There are many probiotics for sale and one should carefully look for background data before purchasing for efficacy. In my own loft of several hundred pigeons, I have noticed many definite, beneficial effects from using PrimaLac for over a year: • Young bird mortality after weaning is almost “zero”. This has not happened in the past. • Fertility improved, there were less clear eggs, and the young birds grew and developed well. • No young birds developed Adeno, Circo, Pox, or Herpes viral infections for the first time ever. In the past, despite Pox vaccination, some birds always developed “Pox sores” or lesions. • There were fewer young bird losses in training and racing. • Fewer pigeons developed E. coli or Salmonella infections. • Overall feather quality improved. • Droppings are round and firm. • PrimaLac can be used with vitamins and most other supplements. • PrimaLac can be put in the bath water. • PrimaLac can be used with canker and coccidia medicines. • Antibiotic usage decreased, thus reducing the development of resistant strains of bacteria and lowering the cost of antibiotic use. • Feed consumption decreased. I have found it an especially useful disease preventative in damp, cold and hot, humid weather, where bacterial and yeast infections thrive. In-depth discussions with several fanciers have indicated that they too felt it was quite beneficial as a health aid for their pigeons. Overall, I have observed no negative side effects from its use, and feel it is a real benefit to help keep our pigeons healthy.
Hi you guys. As regarding which probiotic I decided to use! Throughout the last few years I have been buying some additives from the USA, including what is called a Vita pro Combi mix of pro biotics. This is now being sold in the Uk @ £6.50 per sachet which should, normally last half a season at least. Does Dr. Larry think that by using this, I am still on the right lines. Incidentally the water turns yelow on application, as most "cures" do.
Vic, with Vita Pro Combo Mike Ganus has produced a combination of probiotics, electrolytes, vitamins and amino acids. It will be helpful for your birds, but I cannot say whether or not the probiotics are avian specific as is PrimaLac. It will probably do the job for you.
You are correct in your statement but as evidence has proved you cannot get everything with the torch. The best way is wet the area then dry it and then you have better idea on the areas you have missed.
slightly dampen the floor with cheap bleach and use a scrubber to work it in leave it for about 5/10 minutes then use a blow torch on it and see how clean your floor comes up ,use it on wooden floor grills as well the bleach draws out all stains etc and kills lots of nasties and the bleqach only costs pennies ,being doing thisfor years with no problems in loft ,onlything is wear a mask
Vaccination will only cover that variant of salmonella so what is the point of vaccinating when we dont know what strain we get.
I replied to your views on eradication (culling) and colostrum earlier. I'd like to pick-up on this bit of your post.
At first glance, what is said appears true, but if it was, it would completely rubbish our current understanding of how vaccination actually works.
Vaccination was first discovered after one village doctor noticed while folk all around them in the same village died of smallpox, certain milk maids never even got sick with it. What they did get sick with was cowpox, and it was meeting that version of the disease that had 'programmed their immune system' to meet and beat the greater challenge of smallpox, which was a deadly disease in Britain in those days, while nowadays its ... unknown?
We also have veterinary advice on maintaining background levels of cocci and trichomonas in our pigeons, based on the same understanding. There are numerous strains of each parasite, some more deadly than others. But 'programming their immune system' by constant exposure to low levels of these weaker strains, ensures immunity against any of the deadlier ones, should they ever meet them.
What I would add, is that vaccination effect does depend on the size of the challenge, and I think this is maybe what your Uni contact is saying. If a vaccinated bird became heavily infected then I believe it would fall ill with the disease, (but recover, rather than die?) I think you will find that warning on the leaflet accompanying these vaccines?
Vaccination is another way of 'eradicating' disease from groups of animals. The pathogens are still with us, but they cannot infect due to immunity.
Home
Portal
Search
Register
Login
Welcome to the Pigeonbasics Forum!
Print Thread
Report to Moderator
Male
Logged
Private message
WLM
Female
Site
